sooooooo

the Pandion is lighter and a bit "quicker" in action. About a 400 scandi to 450 skagit line recommendation so far

available sometime in mid-late October, so most likely November or December

 

How much will these bad boys cost?

 

is Pandion also designed by MKinney and RMeiser?

 

update:

I did a Google search and found the following:

http://www.burfish.com/catalog/061294pan.html


Composition: Kevlar and IM6 Graphite

Note:
* Includes custom cordura rod case
* Anodized aluminum reel seat with a matching woven graphite insert
* Titanium oxide stripping guides and chromium impregnated snake guides
* Emerald green with rich blue wraps and highlights and finished with flor grade cork with burled accents


Weight: 8.4 oz
Length: 12ft 9in
Cost: $329.95

The Pandion Series two handed rods designed by renowned expert Nick Curcione are the ultimate tool for overhead
and skagit casting. The new Pandion Series rods are light in the hand yet extremely powerful, delivering extreme
distance with minimal effort.

Whether you are launching flies into the surf, or you're knee deep in your favorite steelhead run,
these rods let you cover more water - putting your fly in front of fish that you couldn't reach with your
single hand rods. Pandion rods are built with our kevlar Axiom technology making them incredibly smooth
with remarkable distance and damping qualities.

Pandion rods are emerald green with rich blue wraps and highlights and finished with flor grade cork
with stylish burled accents. The rods feature an anodized aluminum reel seat with a matching woven graphite
insert. Titanium oxide stripping guides and chromium impregnated snake guides further adorn this handsome blank.
Available in 6-, 8- , and 9-weight.


Cheers

 

They are pretty nice rods but I find it strange that they are in a price point that competes with TFO's Deer Creek Series.

 

Good point Poppy

As you of all people know the DC series has a loyal following. Sounds like this is a fairly stout stick, like the VXP. Maybe more of a 6/7?? Certainly geared for salt if so desired.

I was really excited for this rod. Boat builders from skiffs to yachts regard boat design as a series of compromises. I would think rod design to be similar.

The Axiom SH rods have a good reputation for being fast, tough, good value, but not overly stiff

I agree with you in the price target being questionable but, I'm not sure where they could have gone given the materials. Nick Curcione certainly has the experience to make a good rod and I'd love to meet the guy especially given he is an academic. I'd be interested what his approach was in concept and then what changed in the final product.

Materials:

I understand that carbon reel seats lighten up the overall weight but I think they look cheap and I've seen them crack, not to mention they scratch easy and don't adopt the weathered timeless look when they are scratched like aluminum or wood. Doesn't seem to bother Orvis, Reddington, Leland, or Decho owners though to name a few.

I'd prefer an unsanded unpainted blank if they want to save weight

Sounds like a fast action stiff lightweight chucker with a guesstimated grain weight of 400+

For comparison the Vision 12'6 6w scandi grain weight is suppose to be between 350-400

Have you been able to get your paws on one yet Poppy? I'm curious about the lower handle and how it meets the reel seat. Can't tell in this pic

 

The oddest thing I find in the rod description is that the Pandion is both the ultimate overhead and skagit rod. My experience with graphite design for both Meiser and Anderson is that those casting disciplines prefer rods that have very different flex patterns. I expect that when we see these rods, they will excell in either one or the other, but not both. Would like to know how Poppy feels about that. steve

 

Steve ~

Any ideas on the grain window for the DC 13 6/7?

Pandion -

As a surf rod wouldn't it more geared to Skagit and big salt flies? Aaron @ Kienes felt it was a dedicated overhead/Scandi rod - he also said it was light

 

Steve, I don't design graphite, but I'm into the technicalities of rod design and speak with designers like yourself a fair bit - and I couldn't agree more. Sure, any rod can be made to perform for any casting style, but the typical design parameters for overhead vs. skagit are about as different as they come.

 

They are pretty light in the hand. There's a lot of ways to use tackle and like MSB says however you get it out there if it works "for you" is good so maybe it will do both for some people. I send a lot of skagit heads to Northeast striper fishermen that are hucking them overhead off the beach so maybe that's where the overhead/skagit reference comes from.

Here are the specs from my dealer catalog:

6wt=12'9" @ 8.4oz 400-500grns

8wt=13'3" @ 9.2oz 500-650grns

9wt=13'9" @ 10.1oz 700-750grns

Deer Creek=13'-6/7 450-700grns is what's listed in the catalog

 

As always, great perspective and insight


Thx Poppy

 

"The Pandion Series two handed rods designed by renowned expert Nick Curcione are the ultimate tool for overhead and skagit casting."

Nick Curcione is originally a New England salt water FF, moved to San Diego and mainly fished salt water. He is a retired college prof. and I believe has moved back to the East coast. I have several salt water FF friends who have known him for many years, I have only met him a few times and do not have a personal connection.

I believe these rods are mainly designed for DH overhead salt water casting.

_______________

The new DC 13ft 6/7 rod labeled at 450/700gr is a disappointment.
I expected a range of 400/600gr for this rod to fill the gap between the 12.5ft 5/6 (350-550gr) and the 13ft 7/8 (450-700gr).

My favorite 6wt DH rods like 350/390gr Scandi and 425/475gr Skagit lines.

Regards,
FK

 

[I The new DC 13ft 6/7 rod labeled at 450/700gr is a disappointment.
I expected a range of 400/600gr for this rod to fill the gap between the 12.5ft 5/6 (350-550gr) and the 13ft 7/8 (450-700gr).

The 13' 6/7 grain window listed above seems like a mistake, given that it overlaps exactly with the 13' 7/8. Have you thrown the 6/7 to label it a disappointment?

J.James, a few years ago Steve Godshall built me a 13'4" rod that loaded up for tossing 5/6 wt lines - it was actually too light for my fishing needs, so got sold. He based it off a Gary Anderson blank. Maybe you ought to talk to Steve or Gary and have one of them build THE rod you are looking for, end of quest. An added benefit of working with Steve and Gary is that you needn't navigate through the usual fishing industry hype to get what you want

 

i cast the "demo" at the IFTD show in NOLA in Aug
I liked it
don't remember which model
but after some pond casting, I was interested

 

FK -

I agree entirely. Seems redundant. I was hoping we had a real 6w 13' rod this fall. We don't need another 7w in the mix. The VXP 6w was is the same, more of a 7/8 than a 6

 

The Pandion series is a very impressive two hander collection, I especially like the 6wt 12' 9" rod. The 13' 9" 9wt is a real work horse. I've only been able to cast them at the "ponds" in SF. I am no expert but they are much different than my Deer Creeks, moderate/fast action in my opinion, that flex nicely through the butt under load.

Nick is indeed a Salt water fly fisher. Originally from the East Coast, he is currently living in San Francisco. When he isn't fishing or attending shows, you can find him at the GGACC center or West pond.

He's always experimenting with his rods, flies, and tackle. He has been working on the TFO Pandion series for a while. Recently he has taken a very keen interest in using two handers in the salt, both for over head casting and more traditional two handed casts while wading some Hawiian flats for bones.
rvreclus

 

Guys ...

The grain window for the Deer Creek 13'0" 6/7 is 400 to 600+ grains.

Skagit shooting heads: 450-500 grains <> Tips to 150 +-

Scandi shooting heads: 400-450 grains

Classic Speys to 550 +- grains

Speed of recovery: Fast/Medium fast

Flex: Uniform progressive

Suitable for all game fish from 5 to 15 pounds+

She is very similar in flex and speed of recovery to the Deer Creek 13'0" 7/8 but down grained by net 100.

The rod is a delight to cast <> A hard working, caster friendly, durable mid power rod.

Meiz

 

"Guys ...
The grain window for the Deer Creek 13'0" 6/7 is 400 to 600+ grains.

Skagit shooting heads: 450-500 grains <> Tips to 150 +-

Scandi shooting heads: 400-450 grains"


Thank you, that is what I was expecting.

Regards,
FK

 

Thank you to everyone for their replies

Sorry for the tardy delay, a few busy days and responding on my phone is not preferable

I just wanted to thank everyone for the great advice and how sincerely awesome it is to have access to the wealth of experience and expertise offered here.

I read all of the above attentively and I want to thank those of you who continually take time out of your day to engage others here with patience and respect. It is generous, the information is interesting and helpful, and the style by which you all communicate allows for more involved discussion and keeps the focus where it should be.

I hope I can reciprocate the gesture someday

Many thanks!

 

Guys ...

The grain window for the Deer Creek 13'0" 6/7 is 400 to 600+ grains.

Then somebody should give the above info to TFO because that's not the the numbers printed in the dealer's catalog.

 

6wt=12'9" @ 8.4oz 400-500grns (100gr window)

8wt=13'3" @ 9.2oz 500-650grns (150gr window)

9wt=13'9" @ 10.1oz 700-750grns (50gr window)

Those grain windows are strange

And grain abbreviation is gr

 

From Dan Blanton's website.

Posted by Nick Curcione on 2011-10-30 13:39:54

I am largely responsible for the design features we incorporated into the Pandion Series. As many of you know the vast majority of my fishing is saltwater and I wanted a series of double-handed rods that would be particularly well suited for overhead and Skagit casting in the salt. These rods differ from our DeerCreek series primarily in the fact that they have stiffer butt sections and kevlar has been added to the composition mix. This allows one to cast significantly heavier grain weights than normally specified for a given weight designation. The three rods in the series have been rated very conservatively but here is is a sample of what I've been using in the surf here in the SF Bay area: On the 9/10 I'm throwing a Skagit combo and sinking tip section that's approximately 790 grains. The 8 wt will handle a 740 grain combination and the 6 is comfortable with approximately 650 grains. I hope this helps with your questions

 

From Dan Blanton's website.

Posted by Nick Curcione on 2011-10-30 13:39:54

The three rods in the series have been rated very conservatively but here is is a sample of what I've been using in the surf here in the SF Bay area: On the 9/10 I'm throwing a Skagit combo and sinking tip section that's approximately 790 grains. The 8 wt will handle a 740 grain combination and the 6 is comfortable with approximately 650 grains. I hope this helps with your questions

Hi all,
I'm looking for my 1st 2H rod and the #9 13'6'' TFO Pandion is my best option so far in terms of price and brand quality/warranty...
As per Nick Curcione comment I understand that the most balance combination is actually over the suggested grain window he designed? Am I right?
In the other hand any suggestion for a Skagit set up for that rod? I'm purchasing a combo which includes a RIO Windcutter Spey Line and any help for my second line suggestion will be welcome.
Any personal feedback for this rod?

Thanks in advance. I’m totally noob on 2h fishing and any help is more than welcome

 

Kind of disappointing with the #6 that showed up today. I feels like it would have a nice flex for throwing shooting heads in the surf, but for spey casting I think I'd stay with a DC. Not to mention the cosmetics are a bit iffy, but to each their own.

 

Come on... This is the best we can do for a brand new spey rod
designed by Nick Curcione almost exclusively designed for Striped Bass.
Has anybody Fished the 9wt.

 

Help, I am getting confused. There is the Pandion 6wt 12 9 and the 8wt 13 3, but is there also a DC 13 6/7 now? Haven't seen it on the TFO website yet... If so, when is it coming onto the market?

 

The last revision I analized on the TFO13067DC was awesome. If the production blank holds true it will be one of their BEST. steve

 

SPG,

Are these new DC models (the 13067 and 14067) similar in action to some of the existing DC models? For instance, is the 13067 similar to the 13087 (which has more of an MKS type action) and is the 14067 similar to the 14078 (which I understand to have more of a highlander type action)?

Thanks

 

JBC ... Quote from earlier in the thread

"Guys ...

The grain window for the Deer Creek 13'0" 6/7 is 400 to 600+ grains.

Skagit shooting heads: 450-500 grains <> Tips to 150 +-

Scandi shooting heads: 400-450 grains

Classic Speys to 550 +- grains

Speed of recovery: Fast/Medium fast

Flex: Uniform progressive

Suitable for all game fish from 5 to 15 pounds+

She is very similar in flex and speed of recovery to the Deer Creek 13'0" 7/8 but down grained by net 100.

The rod is a delight to cast <> A hard working, caster friendly, durable mid power rod.

Meiz "
__________________
Bob Meiser...R.B. Meiser Fly rods
www.meiserflyrods.com

 

Thanks Bob! (guess I should have re-read the whole thread)