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All kinds of fun info to read on this one. Google idylwyld and umpqua and just start browsing. If the idylwyld Facebook page is still up there's some interesting reading there too.

**** started unraveling in a hurry...:eek:
 

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Pupil of the river.
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IIRC Umpqua bought them. They are probably in the final process of their conversion.
I believe there is a lot more to it than that. Some people claim that Umpqua ate them.
 

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Interesting reading on their facebook page.

All kinds of fun info to read on this one. Google idylwyld and umpqua and just start browsing. If the idylwyld Facebook page is still up there's some interesting reading there too.

**** started unraveling in a hurry...:eek:
"Umpqua Officers Named as Individual Defendants -
On July 1, 2014, Jeff Fryhover, Daniel Eisenmenger, and Bruce Olson became individual defendants in the lawsuit captioned Idylwilde, Inc. et al v. Umpqua et al, USDC No. 3:13-cv-02009-HZ, making them potentially personally liable for the alleged damage to Idylwilde, Inc. and Zach Mertens. See the allegations against them by clicking on the link to the First Amended Complaint.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/kgnjv0qnkjpk0zq/Amended Complaint.pdf "

Family appears to be back in Hawaii (again from their Facebook page).
 

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Pullin' Thread
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And just think, a mere 40 years ago there were several hundred folks in the US and Canada tying flies in their home and making a decent living doing so. Heck, even Dan Bailey's Flies had folks tying flies in the other side of the shop.

Then came Umqua (started by two fellows who were among the hundreds making a decent living tying flies in the US) and all that changed rather quickly. Since the flies were tied in Sri Lanka with the tyers being paid the ungodly sum of $1.00 per a 10 hour day (not per hour, per day), there was no way US tyers could compete. And fly fishers got into the mindset that if a fly cost more than $1.50-$2.50, it was overpriced. Perhaps a return to flies tied in the US or Canada might be in the future.
 

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And just think, a mere 40 years ago there were several hundred folks in the US and Canada tying flies in their home and making a decent living doing so. Heck, even Dan Bailey's Flies had folks tying flies in the other side of the shop.

Then came Umqua (started by two fellows who were among the hundreds making a decent living tying flies in the US) and all that changed rather quickly. Since the flies were tied in Sri Lanka with the tyers being paid the ungodly sum of $1.00 per a 10 hour day (not per hour, per day), there was no way US tyers could compete. And fly fishers got into the mindset that if a fly cost more than $1.50-$2.50, it was overpriced. Perhaps a return to flies tied in the US or Canada might be in the future.

That pretty much sums up a lot of stuff that has changed in the last few decades. Well said.

MB
 

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There's still a market for top quality hand tied, just as there is in bench reels and hand planed bamboo.
I got some flies tied by Gerald Bartsch and Erik Helm for my BC trip a couple of years back, and they are beautiful and a pleasure to look at and use. (My first ever BC fish was a chrome beauty on a James Reid bamboo, Mark Shamburg bench reel and an Erik Helm Winter's Hope)
Do they catch more than an offshore tied fly? Maybe not, but that's down to the operator rather than the tool. And that may be totally beside the point, I just like owning and using nice things, and supporting artisans.

Cheers,
S
 

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The way it works....

If you read Freds post, a suit was filed....based on my experience, umpqua elected to buy them to settle the suit...in likely anticipation of having to pay damages something lousy they did to Idyl.....

I think its a bummer, I enjoyed their style and marketing....:(
 

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Also read BBB's, post seven, and link.

If you read Freds post, a suit was filed....based on my experience, umpqua elected to buy them to settle the suit...in likely anticipation of having to pay damages something lousy they did to Idyl.....

I think its a bummer, I enjoyed their style and marketing....:(
Serious background info on how they got to the suit.

fae
 

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Pullin' Thread
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Sevilla,

Yes, there is a very limited market for quality flies that are tied by excellent tyers, but it is very limited. For instance, I've been approached multiple times by folks to tie Glasso spey flies, but they want them for $3.00 per fly. When I tell them that is far too low a price and that I will tie them for $7.00 per fly with a 6 fly minimum of the same fly and same size, they tell me I'm being highly unreasonable and trying to rip them off because they can buy all the flies they want for $2.00-$3.00 each. But when you use good hooks like the Alec Jackson Spey Hook or McNeese Blue Heron Hook (which run around $0.75 USD if you buy them by the hundred of the same size, a lot more if you don't), Blue-eared Pheasant ($175.00 or more per skin), good teal or gadwall for throats (meaning you have to go through it and toss around 20% in the garbage), use good bronze mallard (again you are going to toss around 20%) or rooster necks for the wings (only a small portion of the neck is usable for Glasso spey wings), and spend the time it takes to tie them properly (meaning you will tie maybe 6 per hour for spey flies), $3.00 per fly is very poor wages.

Let's break it down a bit more, $0.75 for the hook, $.30 for the blue-eared pheasant feather (if you buy it by the whole skin, otherwise it is $1.00 or more per feather), $0.08 for the teal or gadwall feather used for the throat (that is if you buy it buy 1/2 oz or more, otherwise, it is more like $0.16 per feather), $0.30 or so for the bronze mallard or doubled pair of rooster neck feathers for the wing, $0.02 or so for the dubbing, $0.02 for the tinsel used for ribbing, and you have about $1.45 or so in material cost for each fly. So at $3.00 per fly, the tyer makes about $1.60. So he earns (before the taxes he owes on them) a grand total of $9.55 for the hour it took him to tie the 6 spey flies, and that is only if they were the same fly pattern and size. If the pattern or size had to change, the number tied would go down a bunch. And after he pays federal and state taxes, he earns less than $9.00 per hour. One is hardly going to get rich, or even afford a new line, let alone a rod, at that wage.

So I ask, how many salmon or steelhead fishers do you know that are willing to pay an individual tyer of spey, dee, and GP's $7.00 or more per fly? Very few because nearly all will simply go on-line or down to their local fly shop and buy imported flies for $3.00 or less.
 

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I'd starve as a commercial tier.

Sevilla,

Yes, there is a very limited market for quality flies that are tied by excellent tyers, but it is very limited. For instance, I've been approached multiple times by folks to tie Glasso spey flies, but they want them for $3.00 per fly. When I tell them that is far too low a price and that I will tie them for $7.00 per fly with a 6 fly minimum of the same fly and same size, they tell me I'm being highly unreasonable and trying to rip them off because they can buy all the flies they want for $2.00-$3.00 each. But when you use good hooks like the Alec Jackson Spey Hook or McNeese Blue Heron Hook (which run around $0.75 USD if you buy them by the hundred of the same size, a lot more if you don't), Blue-eared Pheasant ($175.00 or more per skin), good teal or gadwall for throats (meaning you have to go through it and toss around 20% in the garbage), use good bronze mallard (again you are going to toss around 20%) or rooster necks for the wings (only a small portion of the neck is usable for Glasso spey wings), and spend the time it takes to tie them properly (meaning you will tie maybe 6 per hour for spey flies), $3.00 per fly is very poor wages.

Let's break it down a bit more, $0.75 for the hook, $.30 for the blue-eared pheasant feather (if you buy it by the whole skin, otherwise it is $1.00 or more per feather), $0.08 for the teal or gadwall feather used for the throat (that is if you buy it buy 1/2 oz or more, otherwise, it is more like $0.16 per feather), $0.30 or so for the bronze mallard or doubled pair of rooster neck feathers for the wing, $0.02 or so for the dubbing, $0.02 for the tinsel used for ribbing, and you have about $1.45 or so in material cost for each fly. So at $3.00 per fly, the tyer makes about $1.60. So he earns (before the taxes he owes on them) a grand total of $9.55 for the hour it took him to tie the 6 spey flies, and that is only if they were the same fly pattern and size. If the pattern or size had to change, the number tied would go down a bunch. And after he pays federal and state taxes, he earns less than $9.00 per hour. One is hardly going to get rich, or even afford a new line, let alone a rod, at that wage.

So I ask, how many salmon or steelhead fishers do you know that are willing to pay an individual tyer of spey, dee, and GP's $7.00 or more per fly? Very few because nearly all will simply go on-line or down to their local fly shop and buy imported flies for $3.00 or less.
There is no way I could tie 6 Glasso style flies in an hour. I would be making much less than minimum wage as a commercial tier at those piece meal rates...
 

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seaterspey
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2,198 Posts
I consider Spey and Dee flies more as art, each person has their own style and that is reflected in the fly itself.

I will buy one or two flies that I like at a shop that I'm visiting but after that I will make my own and copy the best I can. I just have more confidence in the flies that I tie myself even if I'm with a guide and they want to use the flies they tie.

Trout flies are easy and I only fish maybe a dozen patterns in different sizes and colors.

KC
 

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Pullin' Thread
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Alchemist,

You're right, very few tyers can tie 6 Glasso spey flies in an hour. And those of us who can have tied multiple thousands of them, but none of us who can were not able to do so until after we tied hundreds (as in like 400 or more) of them. Unfortunately, the very vast majority of fly salmon and steelhead fishers who want to fish with spey flies won't pay a tyer a fair price given the skill level, amount of time it took to get skilled enough to tie 6 or so an hour, and cost of good hooks and materials.

And fly fisher folks (many who are willing to pay $700.00-$2,000.00 for a rod, or $400.00-$1200.00 or more for a reel, $400.00 or more for waders, etc.) never even consider that the poor guy or gal tying for the imported fly company only earns between $1.50 and $2.00 per a 10 hour day, not $1.50 per hour, $1.50 per day.

This is the state of affairs today and has been since Dennis Black and Dave Hall started Umqua Feather Merchants.
 
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