Spey Pages banner

1 - 20 of 34 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
254 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
A search on this site didn't produce any hits, but then I may be asking the wrong question. Google just looked at me like I was crazy. Are there any recipes for Skagit lines? More to the point, what kind of line do you have to mutilate and glue together to make a 600 grain head 37 to 40 feet long, including a tip?

Matt
 

·
chrome-magnon man
Joined
·
5,375 Posts
Windcutter

Try this Matt:

for an 8 or 9 weight rod, take a 10/11/12 Windcutter multi-tip, remove the middle belly section, then loop on your sink tips.

Mike Kinney showed me this and it is pretty slick.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
254 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
Dana,

That is exactly what I'm going to do, but I hear Marlow and them talking about making one from scratch. I was just wondering what lines they use to peice together a Skagit head. I'm thinking you would have to start with 12, 13 or 14 wt. line just to get your floating section to be that short. I'm just wondering how much line one has to sacrifice to come up with the perfect Skag head for the very perfect CND Skag Special rod. Plus I need some something to occupy my pea brain until the new Scan Heads and SA Skag heads hit the fly shop shelves.

Matt
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
224 Posts
Finally going to get to try the set-up Dana described (and Topher Browne in a past thread). Heading south to Terrace early tomorrow for a week of steelheading. I'll post a report on the casting and fishing when I get back. Granted, I'm a rank amateur at this game, and will be fishing my new Greenie 13'2" that hasn't even been put together yet, lol. But I'll give it a go anyway, and let you know the results.

Tight lines, and take care.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
627 Posts
Matt

You can get pretty technical with all this line splicing stuff and it is good fun, I did this for years with the shorter heads with a lot of advice from Kinney. Mike has pretty much went to the windcutter now with both sections removed and he loops his tips to this, it gives you about 35' to work with depending on length of tip. Hopefully I will be able to get him to show up at the clave saturday? I am sure he won't mind going over line recipes with you, he is a wealth of knowledge.


Brian
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
439 Posts
Cortland

Cortland makes some Floating shooting heads in 13, 14, and 15 weights. You will have to dig in the catalog for them as they are a 333 product.
The 15 weight is around 500 grains at 30 feet.
Speyrd AKA Leroy...............
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
210 Posts
Homemade Skagit heads

In order to make the bigger Skagit heads like the originators do, you need sections of super large floating line for the body. Trouble is, nobody makes line that large. Leroy is right, however, that Cortland makes the largest weight floating lines in their floating shooting heads - up to
15-weight. The guys who originated the Skagit heads had a special custom run of very large diameter floating lines made for them by a manufacturer. They had lengths made of 100's of feet of level floating line that was literally off the charts - maybe 19-weight and 17-weight - and cut and splice those sections to make their heads. The key is to have a short (25-30'), extremely heavy floating body so that attaching about 15' of tips will give a 40-45' head. Getting 500+ grains into only 25-30' of the body requires some pretty heavy rope. Using the heaviest floating lines (Cortland), you can probably make a Skagit head for a 7/8 weight, but I don't think you can find the material for a 9/10 weight rod.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
254 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
Thanks for everyones help. I was able to get the search to work for me by using the right word combos and people have emailed me some info. Plus I ran into Ed Ward down on the river and asked him some questions. I think I'm going to use Loop heads with different tip lengths for awhile on my Skagit Specialist. Ed had mentioned using different lengths of T-14 for tips on his Skagit heads. I'll also try WC 10/11/12 with the tips removed.

For the purpose of putting up info for other FNG's(Frickin' New Guys), I'll relay some stats on the loop heads that I recieved and some info that I got for future use that I found helpful.

ADAPTED LOW FLOAT #7-8 rods 11.6´- 12´: Length: 9.8 meters(32.1') Weight: 21 grams(324 gns)

ADAPTED LOW FLOAT #8-9 rods 12´- 12.6´: Length:10 meters(32.8') Weight: 26 grams(401gns)

ADAPTED LOW FLOAT #9-10 rods 13´- 13.6´: Length: 10.8 meters(35.4') Weight: 29 grams(447gns)

ADAPTED LOW FLOAT #9-10 rods 14´- 14.6´: Length: 11 meters(36') Weight: 29 grams(447gns)

ADAPTED LOW FLOAT #10-11 rods 15´- 15.6´: Lenght: 11.8 meters(38.7') Weight: 33 grams (509gns)



You need to establish some idea of how many grains of weight that it takes to load the rod. I would suggest borrowing a 9-10-11 and 10-11-12 Windcutter from someone and then trying them on the rod for a couple of days. Cast with each particular line for an hour or so before switching. Do this several times and take note of how each feels on the rod (too light, too heavy, just right, etc.). This exercise will get you into a ballpark range of what it will take to load the rod and this will determine what weight lines you will need to use to build your Skagit line. Also, you may not have to build one at all. I have no personal experience with the Loop heads, but from what I have heard they are the right length (46'?) for Skagit casting. The only difference will be that you will probably need to get one that is a line size or two heavier than the labeled rod rating ( Loop line labeled as 10 weight for use on a 9 weight rated rod).----The optimum line length for Skagit casting is 3 to 3 1/2 times the length of the rod being used. For example, I am using a 13'9'' Burkheimer 7/8/9 for winter/spring steelheading. The length of the shooting head that I use on this rod is 42 feet long. (Riveraddict)

As for the lines I build, I use many pieces up to 15 wt, depending on the rod. I suspect you have a rod that will work for you with the right stroke and line. A rule of thumb, but only a starting point, is to make a head 3 times the length of the rod. Use loop to loop connections so pieces can be changed for fine tuning. Make up pieces 2, 3, 4, 5 and 6' long with a loop on each end. the loops must be stiff but not rigid. You can make them from the belly of a floating 10 wt DT. You will want to keep them even if not used for now. The belly of the head will be any thing from a 12 wt to a 14 wt about 23 feet long. The remainder of the line will be sink tip to make up your 36' head a floating line. Remove the sink tip and use a piece from a 9 DT for a total of 44 to 46 ft for your rod. (Marlow)

Thanks again everyone,

Matt Burke
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,273 Posts
Skagit Lines

AAAAAAAAArrrrghhhhhh! The rivers look like #@!%! I wish that I could just do like a bear and hibernate through November and the first half of December!
The easiest Skagit line to make is to take a Windcutter one line size heavier than that which you currently find comfortable to use, take the 15' middle section and cut it into two pieces. You will now have one 6' section and one 9' section. Put a loop on the cut end of each. Now go out on the river and insert the 9' section in between the main belly and the tip that you are using. Cast and play around with it for awhile. Then take out the 9' section and insert the 6' section. Play around with it for a while. One of the two should work very well. In general, the 6' section usually works better with the heaviest sink tip, and/or big/heavy flies. The 9' section will usually work best with the floating/ light sink tips, smaller flies. This is assuming that the 15' mid section is a level piece of line. It was a few years ago, but the Windcutter profile may have changed in the interim.
Trying to build one from scratch is getting to be just about impossible due to the scarcity of 14 weight flylines.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
254 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
Thanks,

You are the master blaster. I know the upgrade is tapered. If you put it on backwards, you can't cast to save your soul. See ya down at Aaron's on Saturday.

Matt
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,547 Posts
Is this a Skagit line?

I was on the main Nooksack River late this afternoon, trying out a new line: an Orvis WF13 tarpon line (on a 15-foot 10/11 rod) with most of the front tip cut off (at .070") and looped. As expected, it easily handled my heaviest tip, a 15-foot LC-13, and hooked salmon on my first and third casts. (That wasn't expected.)
The line seems a good fit for the above rod. I couldn't cast it as far as I can a DT or extended-belly line, but up to 60-65 feet, casts and mends were easy.
Now, all I know about Skagit lines is what I read here, but it seems to me that this is an inexpensive (about $1 per AFTMA number on eBay), knotless, easy-to-assemble lob-monster for heavy tips. If I'm not getting what a Skagit line is in its essence, can someone set me straight?

:confused:
 

·
loco alto!
Joined
·
2,979 Posts
Did the tarpon line coil like a snake in the cold weather? Shooting line seems to be a hallmark of the Skagit style
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,547 Posts
Normal or kinky?

That is a risk with a line intended for tropical use, isn't it? In air around 42 Fnht., the running line was somewhat kinky, not too bad. I didn't make a full-out effort to straighten it out. The belly didn't seem kink-prone at all.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
254 Posts
Discussion Starter #17
I was wondering about the Tarpon line too. Seems like it would be stiff to turn over in our cold weather since it's tropical. Also the mastery windmaster. There are both salt and fresh water types in the 13 wt area. SA stats say the freshwater type is set up for cold water and more flex. If you look at the windmaster profile, one could turn it a 180 degrees and I'll bet the first 15 to 20 feet would be upwards of 14 or 15 wt. Then you could just paste on some 12 wt double taper to finish out the head to say 35 feet, then add your T-14 sink tips. That would have to get a head up above 600 grains. If I can find it on sale, I may try that combo.

Matt
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2 Posts
If you are interested in really heavy and ”aggressive” shooting heads take a closer look at the Powertaper from Guideline in Norway/Sweden. They are “over weighted/under classed”, designed by Mr. Leif Stävmo and his colleagues of Guideline.

The shooting heads in class 11/12 are approximately 13,5 meters (45”) and weights approximately 54-62 grams uncut! (833-956 grains!!!!), all depending on the sink (float) rate. Suggested weights from the manufacturer are: 9/10; 29-35 grams, 10/11; 35-42 grams and 11/12; 42-49 grams when they are cut into their “right length”.
These lines are very popular in Scandinavia and they come in many different sinking grades and classes. The taper is aggressive/”fast” and made to turn over a really big fly.
You need to cut and balance them with tips or polyleaders to get them to cast smooth. I use them with different types of polyleaders and extensions to get the right length and weight. The sinking lines are “density compensated” with a faster type of sinking line in the tip but still quite OK to cast if you balance them well.

There you are, another thing to get you all confused! :devil:

Hopefully you will have some more! “ingredients” to make your own “line-stew”.

:hehe:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
254 Posts
Discussion Starter #19
Line Stew....Man am I hungry. Thanks Spigg, will do a search on those lines when I get back from eating Turkey.

Matt
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
128 Posts
Here's some links to the Guideline pages:
guidelineflyfish.com/fluefiske-03/fluesnorer/guideline3-blue-03.html
guidelineflyfish.com/fluefiske-03/tabeller/guideline-snorer2-03.html
Unfortunately they are not in english but in swedish.
...so here are some translations should you want to take a look:

linvikt färdigt kåpat = lineweight after cutting to proper length/weight
flyt = floating
sjunk = sink
spötyp = rod type

skjutklumpar = shootingheads
enhands = single handed
tvåhands = double handed
färge = colour

Vision makes these kinds of shootingheads too:
visionflyfishing.dk/?side=katalog&sprog=6&kat=4&vis=138 (pages are in english)
 
1 - 20 of 34 Posts
Top