[trout tracker]

Guys, I'm a two handed rod rookie and need a little help/knowledge in determining what sink tip(s) to use on my rod.

Rod is a Beulah 10'6" 5/6 Classic Switch. I've got it lined with 30lb miracle braid running line and a Steve Godshall 351gr, 21.4' Skagit head. Steve recommends tips up to 120gr in weight, I'm trying to determine what length I should have said tips in and what material? T-? cut to length, or should I get pre made ones? Basically, if anyone has suggestions here I'm all ears. I have tips from an old 8wt SH Rio versi-tip line that I could use but they seem quite long, can I use these, if so should I cut them down?

Also have a 300gr Beulah Elixir head for the rod as well, any suggestions for poly leaders would also be appreciated.

I'll likely be using the Skagit head looking for bull trout more often than not, so getting that set up is my first priority. Looking to chuck streamers mostly, if that helps.

....and of course, thanks for any help offered, getting this two handed rod lining black magic voodoo figured out is proving a bit more involved than I initially thought.

 

[domantas]

At that grain/weight skagit I would stick with Rio light MOW or IMOW tips or any of Rio replacement tip up to 100gr in 10'. 120gr seems a bit heavy for this line aspecially if you are a begginer. Your versitips will work fine as well.

Elixir lines are strong scandi lines and will turn over any 10' poly tip.

 

[trout tracker]

Thanks for the reply and advice. Got out today for a brief casting practice session. River was heavily blown out and running high and fast to the point that I had difficulty even finding a place to safely get in to the water and cast.

I did definitely struggle casting a 15' 120gr versi-tip, but with my inexperience it is tough to say if it was my casting abilities (or lack thereof), the length of tip, the weight of it, or a combination of all those factors which is likely.

I will probably try and cut the tip back to 12' and keep working down from there to see if I can find a comfortable length/weight for me to cast. Good news is that the rivers will likely remain high and unfishable for a few weeks yet so I have some time to improve and get a system dialed in.

 

[DH Drifter]

Shorter Tips

I would go with shorter sections of t-8 or maybe t-11 say around 10 ft or under. Lifting a 15 ft tip with a sub 11ft rod will be tough. I use 10ft sinking poly tips as well depending on depth and size if fly.

Less stick will help you as you learn the casts.

DH

 

[JDJones]

The primary objective being chucking streamers for bull trout, should not require anything drastic, certainly no more than T-8. And I would limit lengths to one rod length, max! And don't get carried away with large cone head flies.

 

[fish0n4evr]

A set of MOW Light tips will work. A single 10' type 6 tip, a length of heavy butt-section transitioning to various lengths of tippet with different weighted and unweighted flies will do also.

 

[JDJones]

Depth

A lot of guys, especially those new to this game, can easily get hung up on sink rates as a means of gaining depth, getting down. I know I did. So let's have a look at this. T-8 sinks @ 7"/sec (ips) T-14 @ 9 ips. By comparison, A Rio Power-flex Core (poly) leader 12ft 58 gr also has a sink rate of 7 ips. That's in still water! The Power-flex Core leader is built on 24lb mono, which gives it plenty of turn over capability! This is more than enough to handle anything with the exception of large bunny leeches & intruders. T-8 weighs 8gr/ft, 10ft=80 gr. 58 gr is easier to cast than 80 gr. Duuuh :Eyecrazy:

We are told that prime fly water is walking speed with a depth of 3 to 8 ft.
My theory (developed over the years) is that the max depth any sink tip will attain is a 30° angle. Sin 30°=.5 meaning a 15ft sink tip will get you 7.5ft depth, MAX! After that, it's your fly & the tippet, which hopefully, sinks faster & is already at, or deeper than, the tip. Expecting anything more is a pipe dream.

Look at it from the point of view that the sink tip's function is not only to attain depth but to retain that depth while the fly is under tension. The amount of tension, and when it is applied, controls the depth at which the fly swims.

 

[bender]

Very fast sinking head could be 10ft T14 as a belly and 10ft T11 as a tip making 20ft 250gr head which sinks faster than any Skagit line setups and is quite easy to lift and touch&go cast even with 10'6'' DH rod. If you like SA casts perhaps T8 tip casts better and if you need more weight T17 as a belly increase head weight 30gr. Mow and other tips come handy when experimenting line setup combinations.

Esa

 

[bender]

I did definitely struggle casting a 15' 120gr versi-tip, but with my inexperience it is tough to say if it was my casting abilities (or lack thereof), the length of tip, the weight of it, or a combination of all those factors which is likely.

I will probably try and cut the tip back to 12' and keep working down from there to see if I can find a comfortable length/weight for me to cast.

Just noticed You have these! Don't rush cutting them!

You could buy heavy Skagit belly and cut it to various lengths and loop both ends which then are easy to add to tips to make them shooting heads and to shooting heads to make them heavier. There is only one rule: Each Spey line section should become heavier by length towards the running line (and sing less than which is towards the tip). But of course there is an exception: When Spey line becomes very long it can have a piece of lighter line between thickest section and running line.

Even drastic weight or sink rate change along the head does not have much effect to casting of fishing.

Esa

 

[JDJones]

Fly lines

If you really want to get a handle on the how & why of what makes a fly line (& that includes sink tips) work, Al Buhr's book "How to Design Fly Lines" is the best thing going. $20 anywhere it's sold. A lot cheaper than collecting a bunch of stuff that, in the end, doesn't work all that well.

 

[JDJones]

KISS method

Guys, I'm a two handed rod rookie and need a little help/knowledge in determining what sink tip(s) to use on my rod.

Rod is a Beulah 10'6" 5/6 Classic Switch. I've got it lined with 30lb miracle braid running line and a Steve Godshall 351gr, 21.4' Skagit head.

I'll likely be using the Skagit head looking for bull trout more often than not, so getting that set up is my first priority. Looking to chuck streamers mostly. black magic voodoo s proving a bit more involved than I initially thought.

Somewhere on this hallowed forum, ED Ward outlined his KISS (Keep It Simple Stupid) method for getting ones feet wet in this game. The logic being, learn one thing, and learn it well, before moving on. As clearly demonstrated in this one thread alone, ask twenty different people's opinion and you will get twenty different answers. Confusing at best. Waste of time at worst.

 

[trout tracker]

Thanks to all for the replies, certainly lots to think about, appreciate everyone taking the time to try and help me out.

I will continue to keep practicing and playing around with different tip lengths and sink rates to see what work best for me at this stage of my learning curve.

Definitely will have a search for Mr. Wards K.I.S.S. thread, I agree that learning the basics and building on those fundamentals is likely the best path forward.