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Does anyone no when S. A is going to release ther skagit heads.Designed by marlo bumpuss
S.A skagit heads
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·I talked to SA yesterday about several things, and they mentioned without any prompting from me that they're very frustrated with the fact that the new spey lines aren't ready yet. They have orders up the yazoo and no product to ship. I got the feeling that they are now on the front burner and should be on dealers' shelves quite soon.
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Dave-
They are not being designed with the Skagit Specialist in mind.
I talked to Brian O'keefe not to long ago (PNW SA rep) and he said that SA is trying to perfect the loops on their new lines. Everyone knows SA's factory loops suck (multi-tip lines are a very small market and SA decided it was not worth the investment until now to produce high quality factory loops).
Brian told me we should be looking at January for an estimated date of arrival in shops.
On another note, SA has totally redisgned the overhand Nymph taper. It was designed with Oregon indicator techniques in mind (specifically the Deschutes) where many many steelheaders fish indicators with single-handers but spend most of their time single-hand Spey casting. Brian told me it is a wonderful single-hand Speycasting line (according to him, the best on the market). Estimated time of arrival on the Nymph taper is January as well.
They are not being designed with the Skagit Specialist in mind.
I talked to Brian O'keefe not to long ago (PNW SA rep) and he said that SA is trying to perfect the loops on their new lines. Everyone knows SA's factory loops suck (multi-tip lines are a very small market and SA decided it was not worth the investment until now to produce high quality factory loops).
Brian told me we should be looking at January for an estimated date of arrival in shops.
On another note, SA has totally redisgned the overhand Nymph taper. It was designed with Oregon indicator techniques in mind (specifically the Deschutes) where many many steelheaders fish indicators with single-handers but spend most of their time single-hand Spey casting. Brian told me it is a wonderful single-hand Speycasting line (according to him, the best on the market). Estimated time of arrival on the Nymph taper is January as well.
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194 Posts
Thanks for the quick response Ryan.
Boy, this is sure confusing.
I've been trying to get up to speed on speycasting for a year now, I am passionate about it, I've taken classes, gone to claves, and fished & fished & fished and my speycasting ability is coming along, albeit slowly. But this "field of fishing" could do itself a world of good with some meaningful standards & measures.
I will keep at this because of my passion, but there will be many folks who will not and will give up because this is frustrating, confusing, and difficult.
CND introduces a new Skagit Specialist rod, SA is apparently introducing Skagit head lines, but these aren't designed to compliment each other? That's nuts.
Now I'm curious, what line did folks use to test and tune the Skagit Specialist when it was being developed? Some custom/spliced line that can't be purchased off the shelf no doubt.
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BTW, have the pleasure of trout fishing with Brian in Bend, Oregon some 25 years ago. He was amazing then too.
Boy, this is sure confusing.
I've been trying to get up to speed on speycasting for a year now, I am passionate about it, I've taken classes, gone to claves, and fished & fished & fished and my speycasting ability is coming along, albeit slowly. But this "field of fishing" could do itself a world of good with some meaningful standards & measures.
I will keep at this because of my passion, but there will be many folks who will not and will give up because this is frustrating, confusing, and difficult.
CND introduces a new Skagit Specialist rod, SA is apparently introducing Skagit head lines, but these aren't designed to compliment each other? That's nuts.
Now I'm curious, what line did folks use to test and tune the Skagit Specialist when it was being developed? Some custom/spliced line that can't be purchased off the shelf no doubt.
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BTW, have the pleasure of trout fishing with Brian in Bend, Oregon some 25 years ago. He was amazing then too.
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Skagit Cast Specialist
DLoop - look under tackle for Skagit line recipe. This is one of the line types in its design, however it also does very well with a 8/9 long delta in the midspey range and I have used the 7/8 XLT out to almost 90 feet of the head without overloading the rod.
The rod designer, Nobuo, in this case, designs the rod for a specific purpose with certain lines in mind, then we get to test that rod with many lines to find out what works best for us. The skagit style lines have been in use for a long time with the users "building" their own lines. Now we will be able to buy one without the hassle of building one, if you want to do that.
You can't expect a line manufacturer to build a line for a specialty rod from one manufacturer only. It will have to work on a lot of rods to make it worth their effort.
DLoop - look under tackle for Skagit line recipe. This is one of the line types in its design, however it also does very well with a 8/9 long delta in the midspey range and I have used the 7/8 XLT out to almost 90 feet of the head without overloading the rod.
The rod designer, Nobuo, in this case, designs the rod for a specific purpose with certain lines in mind, then we get to test that rod with many lines to find out what works best for us. The skagit style lines have been in use for a long time with the users "building" their own lines. Now we will be able to buy one without the hassle of building one, if you want to do that.
You can't expect a line manufacturer to build a line for a specialty rod from one manufacturer only. It will have to work on a lot of rods to make it worth their effort.
You could also do what Mike Kinney has been known to do to make a SKagit line. Mike takes a Windcutter with tips and takes out the middle section (tip 2). This makes a very acceptable Skagit line with a belly length of about 40 feet. The Loop Adapted shooting head lines also work very well as Skagit lines. And the new RIO Scandanavian Spey Shooting Head also does the same thing.
In other words, like Ted pointed out, the Skagit style lines have been available, even if they haven't been called by the name of "Skagit Line". This style of line has been around a long time. Trey Combs even provides instructions on how to make them from saltwater WF lines in his book "Steelhead Flyfishing", which was published in 1991. He just didn't call his recipe a "Skagit Line", although that is what it is.
In other words, like Ted pointed out, the Skagit style lines have been available, even if they haven't been called by the name of "Skagit Line". This style of line has been around a long time. Trey Combs even provides instructions on how to make them from saltwater WF lines in his book "Steelhead Flyfishing", which was published in 1991. He just didn't call his recipe a "Skagit Line", although that is what it is.
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640 Posts
Dloop
Your lucky to be getting into speycasting at this time!
Never has there been so many good rods and lines to choose from. There is alot of stuff coming out right now and thats a good thing, infact its about time. 10 years ago we were making our own lines and I don't even want to think about how much money I spent chopping up lines, although it was fun I have to admit and still have a huge box full of pieces of lines. I have my favorites but enjoy trying all the new stuff.
Brian
Your lucky to be getting into speycasting at this time!
Never has there been so many good rods and lines to choose from. There is alot of stuff coming out right now and thats a good thing, infact its about time. 10 years ago we were making our own lines and I don't even want to think about how much money I spent chopping up lines, although it was fun I have to admit and still have a huge box full of pieces of lines. I have my favorites but enjoy trying all the new stuff.
Brian
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427 Posts
Sparkster,
Take a look at the people who had a hand in Skagit Specialist and the SA lines. Can we come to any conclusions?
BTW, The new Rio lines (heads) are pretty sweet as now that we have more than enough water in our rivers I've had a little time to mess around and find the F/I/S a very functional line.
andre
Take a look at the people who had a hand in Skagit Specialist and the SA lines. Can we come to any conclusions?
BTW, The new Rio lines (heads) are pretty sweet as now that we have more than enough water in our rivers I've had a little time to mess around and find the F/I/S a very functional line.
andre
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119 Posts
Oh yes
Thank you kush for telling it like it is. Cnd and skagit lines go together.
Thank you kush for telling it like it is. Cnd and skagit lines go together.
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194 Posts
Hi Brian, I can tell things have come a long way, and I am greatful for that.highlander2 said:
Sometimes, however, I get the feeling that there could be more partnership across the manufacturers. Maybe it's my skepticism from working in the computer industry for two decades.
I'll try to keep my frustration in check.
DLoop,
It sounds like you are getting at the lack of standardization regarding line wt for 2-hand rods. If you do a search of line weight, you will find there has been quite a discussion on this topic. And you will also find that this lack of standardized line wts. has the most impact on people who are new to 2-hand rods. Remember that just like single-hand rods, 2-hand rods can and are used with WF, DT, shooting heads, sink tips, full sinking, extended belly WF, etc. lines. The difference is that with single-hand rods the line wts have been standardized since 1959, no such standard exists yet for 2-hand rods.
It sounds like you are getting at the lack of standardization regarding line wt for 2-hand rods. If you do a search of line weight, you will find there has been quite a discussion on this topic. And you will also find that this lack of standardized line wts. has the most impact on people who are new to 2-hand rods. Remember that just like single-hand rods, 2-hand rods can and are used with WF, DT, shooting heads, sink tips, full sinking, extended belly WF, etc. lines. The difference is that with single-hand rods the line wts have been standardized since 1959, no such standard exists yet for 2-hand rods.
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194 Posts
Ryan, I got more clarification from Brian that explains some of the confusion here perhaps.NrthFrk16 said:
The new SA Spey Short head (floating only) is coming out in January.
The SA "Skagit Lines" are in the early prototype stage and production dates are not set yet.
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