[sean]

Rio Scan. Heads - Which one for cutting to use tips?

I am looking at getting one for the CND Skagit and do not want to get the sink tip package. I have more than enough sink tips laying about...

So which line should I pick up to cut for tips? Just the floating one and cut back at 15'? Thinking I could also get the tri-color one with the type three head and just cut it off and loop it. Sounds like what they have done with thier tips package.

Thanks for the help.

-sean

 

[Rick J]

Just got back from fishing the Grande Ronde with Scott O'Donnell who is a big WC fan. Before that trip, I did not care for WC's at all and much preferred long belly xlt type lines. That trip convinced me that the WC have their place especially for throwing tips with ease. They were using Wind Cutter multi-tip lines and taking off both tip number 1 and tip number 2 and attaching the sink tip to the balance - this makes a very short head (54'-30' tips = 14' plus a 15' tip) The thing would fly with very little effort.

The one thing to remember if you decide to shorten the line and maybe cut it not just at the 15' mark but also at the 30' mark is you will likely need to get a line weight one or two higher than the rod rating to compensate for the removed grains.

 

[mattzoid]

Sean,

I'm looking at the same problem with my Skagit. Looking through my head and tip case, I've got a bunch of tips that are repeats as far as weights and lengths go. I don't need to buy anymore multi-tip lines. After discussing the Skagit lines with Marlow Bumpus and Bob Pauli and doing the research through the years of posts on this site, I've come up with a plan. Just a floating WC 10/11/12 cut back 30 feet and looped. This should give me a 39 foot head, with a tip, weighing about 550 grains. Marlow said he liked the Skagit with one of his heads that was about a foot or two shorter and ran 580 grains. (Marlow, please slap the student if I'm wrong.) I have heads I made that are the equivalent of the Scan heads with the intermediate middle section and then a sinking tip. I don't like to have to do a little extra roll cast to get it all out of the water before I launch (I prefer these heads for the salt off point no point anyway). For the river I want the whole thing to float except for the tip. The Skagit with my 500 grain head really rocks but at 36 feet, it feels a bit short and I really can't get a good underhand or Skagit cast going. I keep missing the grip even with a longer leader. I figure making a Skagit line out of the 10/11/12 WC with about a 38 or 39 foot head, will be just the ticket. I will probably just buy the floating Scan heads and shred them to pieces until I have the right weight and length too. Can't wait to see what other people have to say.

Matt

 

[Ol Rich]

Rio Scandinavian head with #3 sink tip.

I discussed cutting the line with Simon and he recommended not cutting it. The line has a different profile than the head with tips because Rio wants to supply the multi tip head with their standard tips. I measured the tri color and the tip is signifacantly larger in diameter the the tips from a multi tip line.

Simon said cutting and looping the tri color line would significantly alter the performance of the line. I plan on using sinking leaders if I need to get down further and faster.

I have come full circle. I am using a 7/8/9 WindCutter with tips on my CND 13' 8/9. Have the 10/11 Scandinavian tri color line for my 15' St. Croix.

Rich

 

[mattzoid]

Thanks Rich,

Did Simon happen to say if we could just buy the replacement floating scan head with the unique profile and just use one of the hundreds of standard rio tips that I already own. I don't mean to seem cheap, but my head/tip holder is the size of a brief case and I am out of room.

Matt

 

[Ol Rich]

Matt

The last word I heard was the Skaget head without the tips was not available. Aaron is a better source of information about that then I am. I would like to be able to purchase the heads without tips also.

Rich

 

[mattzoid]

Rich,

Getting a lot of feedback that cutting those floating scan heads is not the best choice because of their profile. If this year's lines go on sale after the new ones come out, I may try it. I was down on the river with Aaron and Ed Ward was there. He was tossing the CND Skag Special with a loop adapted head and sink tip. I have two of those heads and enough sink tip to play with. I'm just going to stick with this for Skagit casting and just wait on the SA and Rio heads to come out so I can make my own evaluation.

It was cool watching Ed do his version of the Perry's Poke. Never seen anyone dump so gracefully. Learned a lot in just a couple minutes. He was just fixin' to whip out a Morlow head, but my kids had had enough and wanted to see the falls. So I missed that. Probably a good thing though. I just would have had a million more questions.

Matt

 

[t_richerzhagen]

Length for Skagit

Matt
Ed Ward said that his heads are 43-45 feet long for his 13' 9" rod, so you might want something a little longer.

 

[mattzoid]

Ted,

It's funny you should say that. After seeing what Ed was doing and what Aaron had rigged up for him to use on the CND Skag Special, I came up with my own rig from my meager supply of line. I hope this will work on my CND Skag Special;

.024 Rio powerflex running line (Ed prefers 50 # flat mono), The 9/10 Loop Low Float head (36 feet and 445 gns) and 15 foot tip, 145 gn type 3 tip. This gives me a Skagit head of 51 feet at 590 gns.

There are tapers at the end of the loop head and at the beginning of the tip. I feel it will hinge too much at that point and will have to trim and do loops. That might get me down to 47 or 48 feet and around 550 grains. Marlow had said he liked the Skag Special with a 580 gn head, but this may be the best I can do until after Christmas.

Matt

 

[highlander2]

shooting heads

Matt

That configuration may do better then you think, I used pretty much the same set up one day on the Skagit exept the tip was 15' of nine weight HD and it did not hinge. The loop belly section even though taperd had no problems. I did feel that the setup was a bit to long for a head, at fifty feet you might as well be using a windcutter. 40' to45' is pretty nice and allows a short and effortless stroke which is I think the whole point of that style of casting. The heads I use to build and cast were only 33' to 38' with no back taper and no front taper, the problem was casting off the running line it does not transfer the energy very well. A short back taper is the key and I have heard a bit of front taper helps but I am not so sure, the sinktip becomes your front taper. I may have to start messing around with these lines again and build one for a specific rod with the improvements that Ed and Marlow have brought about, they sure are fun to cast and are excellent fishing tools as well

Brian

 

[t_richerzhagen]

Reverse DT

Brian/Matt - you can reverse a DT and use the front taper for the rear taper of the head. The belly section is looped and sink tip attached for the front taper. That should give better energy transfer.

Brian - I think a place where a little taper might help is for the faster sinkingheavier poly leaders. The slower sinking/lighter ones do very nicely off an uncut midspey.