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chrome-magnon man
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Discussion Starter #1
Just added some new video of the reverse snake roll on the spey pages. Check it out under the "kush on the reverse snake roll" link on the speypages.com main page.

This is a big file (5MB) so if you aren't on high speed it will take forever--download it at night!

speypages.com
 

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Hi Dana:

Super video footage, thank you! Also, it is very impressive to see Kush cast, very dynamic, nice wedge shaped loop and although I can't see 100% clearly it appears that the leader is straightening nicely.

I'd like to ask some questions regarding the alternatives in a practical fishing situation.
(1) Why would one not use a single spey in this situation, esp. a right handed person? If there was wind blowing from the back it should theoretically hamper both casts, the single Spey and the reverse snake roll.
(2) If you were equally competent with both hands could you not also use a snake roll with the left hand on top? What would you consider the pros and cons in this situation?
(3) Regarding your recent thread on shooting heads would the person familiar with underhand casting and appropriate equipment simply stick to an underhand cast (akin to the single Spey) with the right hand on top?

Since Kush was the caster maybe he could "wade into" the discussion as well.

TL
Tom
 

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Tom,

Practical fishing situations are what I am about, I am always ribbing Dana that he is more interested in casting than fishing (this is only somewhat true) while I just want to figure out how to get it to a fish! The backhand snake roll is a fishing cast. The cast itself is an alternative (I think replacement) to the double spey, which in a river left situation such as this would be used in a downstream wind. To be truthful, the spiral roll is simply my favourite cast - I like it and I use it whenever I can. It is so dynamic that the distances I can cast will match Dana’s single speys and I can do it without thinking - so why not.

As for why not switch hands? This is the subject of another very long thread elsewhere on this board. While I can cast with my left hand on top I prefer to cast cross handed, I am stronger and more effective - especially at longer distances. As well, as Dana mentions in the intro to the footage, the backhand delivery has some inherant advantages. The physiscal limitations of the position “forces” the hands into the perfect firing position, which is something I sometimes have to consciously will myself into on the forehand delivery. To cast cross hand or switch is one of those things that a caster will have to decide for themselves - the bottom line is get it out there.

To finish that thought, casting is not about knowing all the latest casts or cutting edge techniques - it is about catching fish. The reason good technique is important is to allow the fisherman to deal with an entire spectrum of variables. Not only does one need to be able to do all the standard casts, but there are times when you simply have to make stuff up. Where there is a will there is a way - the backhand spiral roll is one of those ways.
 

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Coast2coast Flyfishaholic
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Just sitting here testing the new hispeed connection (5 mins old), first videos tested being casting videos from Speypages.com - awesome!

Tyler, I've watched your casting live and person but I'm still impressed!
 

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Junkyard Spey
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Kush- Very impressive casting, but

what I want to know is what type, or brand of wading staff harness are you using in the video? Your staff seems to stand right at your left hip at attention.
 

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MJC,

This is truely state of the art stuff! I bought a pair of very long ski poles for $6.00 CAN, I put 2 ridges of electrical tape on the shaft about a foot below the grip and tied a good nylon cord between the ridges. I measured just over an arms length of cord and tied on a cheap dog snap and voila. It stands at attention because I attach the snap to the D-ring on front of my waders and then I just hang it over my shoulder and it sits there nicely out of the way but still easy to get to. Seriously hi-tech stuff indeed.
 

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Junkyard Spey
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Kush- Thanks for the info......

I also use one of those high tech staffs with a cord same as your's, but I haven't tried it over my shoulder. I'll give your method a try. At this stage of my life if I wade in "any" water without my staff you'd swear I'd had several of those single malts. Since I'm a line shooter it's a pain having my staff floating down stream at just the right distance to always tangle (at least it seems that way. After looking at the videa again I can see that cord. Thanks for your help!
 

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Kush,

Thats essentially what I have. Used to do a lot of down hill skiing but when relocated to mid west in 1979, that stopped, no mountains here to challenge, used to do Vail, Lake Louise, Banff, and all the NYS and VT major ski areas.

Took the down hill poles and converted like you. Spary painted them dark green, you know for camoflauge. Nice cheap effective solution for twenty something years now.

Great casting, but if I ever through a cast that long here in the midwest, I would be in the trees on the other side except for three maybe four rivers here.

What weight was that spey rod ?

Hal
 

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Hal,

The rod is a Sage 10151 (green blank) and the line is a custom Speydriver.
 

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chrome-magnon man
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Discussion Starter #10 (Edited)
Hi Tom!

In response to your questions,

#1. you certainly could use a single Spey in this situation. What makes a snake roll the cast of choice would be wind conditions and intended casting direction. Expert casters can put a single Spey or Grant Switch through a 90º change of direction, but it is far easier to do this with a snake. Also, the snake is the cast of choice when a 90º directional change and distance are co-factors—the snake is more powerful than the double Spey.

If a tailwind is a problem, it can be largely overcome by having a powerful and arrow-shaped D loop or, in extreme situations, forming the D loop closer to the water to get under the wind. A tough tailwind will become an instant advantage, however, when you come forward for your delivery cast. In really, really, really really, really, really , REALLY tough wind conditions I'm afraid the only solution can be found in the nearest pub.

#2. Yup, if you are comfortable switching hands, you could do this. No pros or cons IMO—just whatever you are comfortable with. Tyler points out something important though—for many casters the backhand casts become their “best” for the reasons he mentions.


#3. If you like the Underhand style you can still use the snake roll, you just need to adjust your technique to allow for the shorter belly of the shooting head. In this case I would favor the left hand on top as the shorter head lengths make it trickier to anchor the leader when casting backhanded. It can certainly be done, it’s just trickier. I'm still working on my Underhand technique, so I certainly find it challenging to cast backhanded with that method.
 

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I just finished watching them all and now I'm just sitting back daydreaming.Man,you guys make it look so easy!Watching how gracefully you all cast makes me very humble.I think if I tried some of those casts I would probably loop coils around myself and drown. :D :eyecrazy:
 

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Asleep at the Reel. . .
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Wind'em up, and wing'em out.

That's an Oscar winning performance for sure. Kush takes plain old casting and turns it into "Spey Ballet."
Kudos to the camera operator too -- good composition, great lighting, well balanced action sequence.
Dana, keep your video recorder rolling, we could use lots more of the same.

Two thumbs up! -- and a wee dram of Balvenie to toast your continued good health.

Cheers!
 

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Coast2coast Flyfishaholic
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*** please hold off temporarily ***

It seems Tylers' video is extremely popular... so popular that between that and the FlyTalk board it helped us exceeded 10,000,000,000 bytes and got shut down this morning! I am contacting the host to increase our bandwidth, which could raise monthly hosting by an additional $60/month.

You can help out by making a bandwidth cost donation, just click on the announcement thread at the top of every board.

Sean, Dana - I will contact you to discuss.

Please enjoy FlyTalk but hold off on the video until further notice.

THANKS!
 

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chrome-magnon man
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Discussion Starter #14
ooooops!

what's wrong with me, putting a feature length casting video up on the speypages for free!!! Some guys get 40 bucks for one of those! ;)

Well, if you downloaded the original you have a rare prize--don't delete it! I've replaced it with a smaller file--one slo-mo cast. If you set your viewer to loop it you'll sorta get the same effect as the original.
 

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What I would like to see (not that I count) is a hook up with some big BC native going airborne. Now that would get the juices flowing....:whoa:
 
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