New Scott spey rods?

There were five all new two-hand rods, called the "LS2" series, unveiled by Scott in Denver:

12' 6 weight
13' 7 weight
14' 8 weight
15' 9 weight
16' 10 weight

All are four piece low profile sleeve ferrule designs, matte black finish with checkered gray wraps, two lined stripping guides, hayfork tip top (very stealthly looking - no flash) with downlocking REC anodized black reel seats (twin locking rings), a simple tapered non-flared foregrip, a longer rear grip than the A2 series with composite cork butt cap replacing the previous high density foam rubber of the newer A2's and ARC's.

The rods are designed to be incredibly light in hand (the 1509 weighs around 8.5 oz., the 1610 around 9.5 oz), yet have a modern, not-too-fast, not-too-slow action with more tip feel than the A2's and more crispness and quicker rebound than the more classic ARC series (which is still available). The feel throughout the range is consistent; for example, if you cast the 1408, the same action and feel is present in the 1610. An incredible amount of time was spent specifying the desired actions and fine tuning on the water and with high speed quantitative digital video analysis. The rods have been designed to excel with casting various belly lengths of line (it's easier to design a rod that throws short bellies than long bellies; a rod that's good with a long belly well will throw a short belly well but not vice versa) and have been designed to accomodate a wide range of casting styles.

A rod sock and aluminum tube is included with Scott's usual lifetime unconditional warranty. The retail is bewteen $575 and $595. My understanding is that produciton is ramping up with preseason orders; retail customers should be able to get the rods before the end of the year, possibly as early as Thanksgiving.

Hopefully this provides some more information...

Peter:

The 1206 is a really light two-handed rod, but is a "Spey" rod in that a standard AFTMA 6 weight overhead line is too light to load it. It is designed for large water/large trout/large heavy flies/streamers, light steelhead fishing (e.g. half pounders, deschutes fish), and smaller water/low water small atlantic salmon fishing. I have not taken a steelhead on the 1206, but took a couple of average sized deschutes fish (6 lbs) last week on the LS2 1307 on medium length casts (80 feet) - very sporting, and I'd say ideally matched. The 1206 in a similar situation I would compare with a single hand medium to medium-fast 10 foot 8 weight as my closest single hand comparison (e.g. A2 1008), which is quite fun. For the 1206, personally, I have used it for dry line steelhead fishing when it's not very windy, and casting distances are generally less than 80 feet. I imagine it would be a hoot to catch larger sea run cutthroat, sea-trout, and grilse with this rod.

With regards to the new standards, one must realize that they are really NEW. Line manufacturers will be the first to make modifications to existing lines to conform (we are working on this right now with the next generation XLT lines). As rod development takes a great deal longer than line development (for example, the LS2's have been in the works for more than 3 1/2 years), and as rod series are much harder to change than lines, it is expected that rod manufacturers will follow over time with labelling and designing rods to match the new standards.

The existing XLT's are very close to the new standards, with several of the lines not needing any changes. The LS2's were designed around a number of industry "standard" lines, and I put together a line compatibility chart which is available somewhere (Scott hasn't updated their website yet). The XLT 6/7 is too heavy for the LS2 1206, I like the XXD 9 weight or a Steelhead taper 9 weight best so far.

Hello Andre:

The internal ferrule has always been at the heart of Scott's philosophy of feel and continuous action throughout a rod, as the ferrule material is the same as the rest of the blank. I think this results in a palpable difference in feel in single hand rods (whether this makes one rod "better" than another is ceratinly debatable - but feel does come into play when choosing bewteen the top drawer rods available... I guess like choosing between great golf clubs). Scott has been sucessful in designing super low profile sleeve ferrules for some time; they are so low profile it's hard to tell where they really are, and the obligatory dead spot in any sleeve ferrule is decreased.

Scott had been resistant to considering a high performance, high end two hand series with a sleeve ferrule for some time, but given the dilution of the impact of a three ferrules spread over a 12-16 foot rod (as opposed to a 7' 6" to 9'6" rod), and given the performance capabilities of some of their own A2 rods and LS2 prototypes, they decided to give it a go. Further, there are some really awesome two-handers out there that have always been sleeve ferrule lay-ups (e.g. some of the T&Ts, Burkie's, etc.), so in my mind there were no intrinsic drawbacks to pursuing sleeve ferrules in a new series.

A major advantage of sleeve ferrule designs is that they are considerably less costly to manufacture; roughly $5 per ferrule compared to about $35 per ferrule for an internal ferrule (the latter is entirely fit by hand). With a goal of introducing a high performance modern two-handed series to their line-up, the decision was made to pursue the rods in an over-fit lay up, and pass the decreased costs of manufacture directly through to the fisherman. The rest of the rod has all the same high quality stuff in it that the ARCs do, but the lay up is different, the materials are different, the feel and actions are different, and I think they complement the more traditional feel of the ARCs nicely.

I must admit to being biased towards the new series, as they cast and feel exactly the way my ideal rod would... Just as Steve Choate had major influence on the new Greased Line series from Loomis, it's been an honor to be able to work with Jim Bartschi on the actions of these rods, and to have a little piece of each of us in every rod.

I would love to hear your thoughts (positive or negative) after you have a chance to give them an extended whack.

Just back from Skeena country where I fished my new 1509 LS2. I loved the rod with long dry lines but because the river was as high as can be and cold and super low vis I tried the rod with a windcutter and a big boy 300 (I was actually forced into it because the airlines lost my other rod tube for a few days with 4 other rods including my 1509 ARC that normally would draw the 300 detail). I was supprised how well the rod handled this set up. Man, is this rod ever light in the hand. I can't wait to give the others in the line a try on the river.

Greg--

which of two rods ( ARC 1509 or LS2 1509) works better for you when using 1)very fast sink tips, 300 gr, 2) lighter tips or floating tip.
It has to be some difference.

Way--

Is LS2 14' wt.8 stiffer then T&T?
Is recovery rate or what you call " rebound" on 14' [email protected] faster then T&T, CND Specialist or Solstice Series?

Thanks
Robert




Thanks
Robert

Steve, I agree with Gary that the 7/8 midspey is a great match for the 1408 ls2. That will be my go to set up for summer steelies. On the 1408 I really like the new Rio Skagit line 8/9 with 5' cheater and 140-150 gn. heads. My buddy Todd fished this set up when we were on the Skagit last week and it was amazing. Last fall i fished the 1307 with a 6/7 midspey for smaller summer runs and it was awesome. I wanted a Skagit style line for the 1307 but complete with a floating tip so i made one by chopping up a 9/10/11 windcutter. I cut at 16.5' from the tip and put a loop on the back side of this tip. Then I cut 9' out from this point back and installed another loop. This line rocks on the 1307 with dry tip or sink tips around 130 grains. The lines weight is 400 grains excluding the tip. I am going to try and perfect the same line with dry tip for the 1408 next.

Robert, I think if I was to only use a Windcutter I would be just as happy with the ARC as the LS2 1509. Because I also like to put midspeys, Grandspeys and the XLT on the 1509 I prefer the lighter LS2. The ARC is a great rod with the windcutter and midspey but I don't do as well with the longer lines with it.

i hope this ramble helps,

Greg

Dana:

Thanks for casting my set-up. It was fantastic to see you poking some serious line out there! I'm glad you liked the combo.

Robert:

I would definitely defer to Greg on all the short head stuff. I'm ashamed to admit that don't understand a word of what he just posted (was that English?)!

The 1409/3 is my favorite T&T that I have own. It is a lovely rod, and has been a good and reliable backup rod for me. In a head to head comparison of the 1408/4 LS2 and T&T 1409, the rods are simply different. Both are on the faster end of action compared to most rods out there. The 1408/4 is a lighter rod for sure, and delivers high line speed, without sacrificing feel. It is happy with both a short head or a long belly. WC-wise, it likes a 9/10/11, and XLT wise, it likes the current 7/8 or the new 8 weight XLT2. It will cast the 8/9 SA short head and the 7/8 mid head, I think the 8/9 mid is a tad heavy. Because the 1408 is lighter than the T&T, I perceive the "rebound", or "quickness" to be faster, although this is purely a matter of individual feel. They both cast a long way, and yield nice tight loops. In my opinion, you can't go wrong with either rod. The LS2 is a 4 piece, matte blank, the T&T is a painted 3 piece.

SSpey: I am working on a line compatibility chart, but don't have all the new lines from all the manufacturers especially with many manufacturers going to the new single line weight designations. Greg knows the short belly stuff, and I hope he will be able to fill in the blanks in my knowledge base. Simon should be testing the rods out with his Rio lines sometime in the near future.

So far, this is what I like (subject to change, please don't take this as definitive list yet - some of my notes were with the prototype LS2's):

1206: 8 weight SA XXD, 8 weight SA steelhead taper, XLT2 6 weight
1307: 6/7 SA short head, 6/7 SA mid, XLT2 7 weight, SLT 6/7
1408: WC 9/10/11, SA short 8/9, SA mid 7/8, XLT 7/8, XLT2 8 weight
1509: WC 9/10/11, SA short head 8/9, SA mid 8/9, XLT 7/8 or 8/9, XLT 2 9 weight
1610: WC 10/11/12, SA short head 9/10, SA mid 9/10, XLT 9/10, XLT2 10 weight, XLT2 11 weight (not XLT 10/11)

Hope this helps.