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Discussion Starter #1
I am looking for Micro Scandi head for my converted single handed rod (#4, 10') to double handed.
For Skagit Heads, Rio Skagit Max Short 200 grain, 17' looks ok, but what about Scandi?

The lightest Scandi head I have found is Rio Scandi, 28ft 210gr and it is probably overkill for my rod.

What lenght and weight you would recommend? My guess is around 160 grain, 20-22' and maybe short poly leader, like 6 foot.
 

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what traditional single hand line do you like on that rod? Might just cut back a nice traditional single hand line with a taper you like to the length and grain weight you want and put a loop in it. May want to splice in some back taper to the line for better flight characteristics but likely not needed. If I were to chose I think I might get a Wulff TT line-maybe a 6 wt and start there and maybe start by using as is without splicing
 

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Vision vibe 65. They come 92 to 185 grains with a 21.3 foot head. It is an integrated line, not just a head. Of course there is steve godshall who can make you pretty much anything you want. I just built an 11 ft 3/4 weight myself and will probably have steve build a line for me.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
what traditional single hand line do you like on that rod? Might just cut back a nice traditional single hand line with a taper you like to the length and grain weight you want and put a loop in it. May want to splice in some back taper to the line for better flight characteristics but likely not needed. If I were to chose I think I might get a Wulff TT line-maybe a 6 wt and start there and maybe start by using as is without splicing
My prefered single handed line is Wulff TT line or Rio Trout LT, so was thinking already to buy TT #6 or even better #7 weight line and start some cutting and maybe adding some belly at the back to get nice Scandi head.

I would prefer factory line anyway :)
 

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Airflow 40+ sh makes a really nice scandi head- you'd have to do a little research on the line weight. I really like a 6wt on a switch that has a grain window in the 280/300 range.
 

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Look at Scientific Anglers new short belly taper, exactly what you are looking for. They are listed in the single hand line page
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Airflow 40+ sh makes a really nice scandi head- you'd have to do a little research on the line weight. I really like a 6wt on a switch that has a grain window in the 280/300 range.
6wt? Is this heavy enough for the switch rod (I guess 5 weight switch rod)?
 

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I'm not sure- I'd do a little more research not the grain window you want for that rod. I know there's been a few threads on here about converting sh to two handers in the low line weight range.
 

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From what I have gathered over the years is that you over line your single hand rod by 2 to 3 sizes. I would think if you follow that rule you would use a 6 or 7 wt line on a 4 wt rod or atleast that is a good place to start. If you have any single hand lines that are a couple sizes larger, put them on a reel and do some testing. This is the only way you are going to find out what works for you. Then, when you are done testing lines come back and let us know what works with your rod.

I have a TFO Ticr x 6 wt with lower handle and that thing rocks with a Ambush 5 wt line at 215 grains which is 2 lines sizes heavier. A single hand 8 wt line weights 215 grains.

Hope this doesn't confuse you, but hope it helps you in your search for the perfect line.:whoa:


Dan
 

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The Airflo 40+ lines are already overweight for line class designations so I wouldn't want to get to wild up-sizing.

The Scientific Anglers SBT (Short Belly Taper) mentioned above is an interesting thought.. enough so that I spent a few minutes snooping up the specs. Been hearing whispers in the wind on this line for quite a while. Appears to be available now. Could not get the specifications image to link so scripted it out old school.

WF-2 Head length 21.5' weight: 100 grains

WF-3 HL 22.3' WT: 120gr

WF-4 HL 23.3' WT: 140gr

WF-5 HL 24.3' WT: 160gr

WF-6 HL 25.3' WT: 185gr

WF-7 HL 26.3' WT: 210gr

WF-8 HL 27.3' WT: 240gr
 

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From what I have gathered over the years is that you over line your single hand rod by 2 to 3 sizes. I would think if you follow that rule you would use a 6 or 7 wt line on a 4 wt rod or atleast that is a good place to start. If you have any single hand lines that are a couple sizes larger, put them on a reel and do some testing. This is the only way you are going to find out what works for you. Then, when you are done testing lines come back and let us know what works with your rod.

Hope this doesn't confuse you, but hope it helps you in your search for the perfect line.:whoa:


Dan
Dan is right about the 2/3wt up weight. The only thing I want to add is to make sure the taper and weight distribution of the line you using works for your intended application. Most of my experience with micro spey is with Scandi styled casting with polyleaders. Haven't been super successful with sink tips without going to a dedicated Skagit styled line.
 

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This is as much fun as my first spey rod and figuring out what line to put on it. :chuckle:

I just understand a lot more now.:rolleyes:


Dan
 

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Discussion Starter #14
I have found one piece of old DT line with nice front taper about 9 foot. I have cut the line to the 24 foot and according to my precision scale, it is 170 grain now. It is not that long taper as Scandi, but for the first test will be ok to see the road load.

Also will take few #6 and #7 foot lines for testing on the water also.

What single handed WF line size would be good for cutting the 200 grain, 17' skagit head? 10 weight? I have tried to measure #8 weight line, but too light for that short head.
 

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Polys or even fluorocarbon, but there is no where near enough mass in these light lines to carry sink tips.
I've experiment with the new Rio Skagit Max with type 3 sink tips. Works okay for a deeper presentation but still no dice for larger wet flies. As the old saying goes, mass moves mass.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Vision vibe 65. They come 92 to 185 grains with a 21.3 foot head. It is an integrated line, not just a head. Of course there is steve godshall who can make you pretty much anything you want. I just built an 11 ft 3/4 weight myself and will probably have steve build a line for me.
What weight for Vibe 65 you would suggest for converted #4 10' rod? From reading all advices for micro Skagit head, I would need 180-200 grain skagit, 17'

So for Scandi work with Vibe 65, which one to select, 154 or 185 grain?
 

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Discussion Starter #17
First test with custom made head from old line, 175 grain, actually 25 foot long, full disaster, probably too long, and too light, can not load the rod at all.
Will make much shorter head today and at least 220 grain.
 

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If you test a double taper line, I would just leave the line whole (no cutting) and keep trying different lengths. I remember poppy telling me this when I first started spey casting but didn't understand the concept back then.

Pull out 25 ft of line and test cast, if to light let a little more slide out.

Do you have any heavier scandi heads. If so put one of rod and only pull out part of head. You will be surprised because most of a scandis weight is in the back part of the line.

A really great idea someone else had was to use tips as heads on light trout speys. They are a lot cheaper and if you don't like it you can sell or use on heavier rod.

Even better find a 15 foot tip in the weight you want and put a poly leader on the end. A 15 foot tip + a 10 foot poly leader give you 25 ft or use a 15 foot tip and you have 30 ft. Make sure you add the weight of polyleader into you over line weight while scandi casting. I think it would make a difference on such a light rod.

Keep us posted and let us know what you find out works with your rod.


Dan
 

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I converted a very old first generation Fenwick HMG 10.5' 5 wt to a switch - very very slow and it does well with a custom skagit line around 250 grains.

For a full line like a TT I think you need to be up around an 8 to a 10 wt - 210 to 280 grains but I also don't think that a typical 30' + head on a traditional single hand line would be excessively long for that rod - after all, standard single hand lines are pretty easily roll castable so should easily work using a dynamic roll cast (read spey cast)
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Or, I can go with Ambush head, 4 or 5 weight?

I have already 8 weight Ambush on my 8 foot converted rod, but this setup is making too much noise on small water. I need something tender for quiet scandi presentations on #4 rod. Not sure if Ambush #4 line is good for this.
 
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