I think this is the same rod I tried at Aaron's Clave in November--it is designed for Chinook, right? We were casting a GrandSpey 10/11 on it (a seriously heavy line) and working really hard to bend it. If this is the same rod it would seem to be a rod designed for fighting a particular type of fish rather than purely as a casting tool, in much the same way that some heavy single handers are designed for marlin--all that really matters is how the rod performs after the cast is made.
I think it would be an awesome rod for big fish--a rod I would love to take into the Dean for early season Chinook--and I would be inclined to fish it with a heavy shooting head system, like the heaviest Windcutter setup.
But again, pure speculation here. I might have been casting a different rod.
Dana, you nailed it right on the head with the 13x13.....And yes you did cast the "Claymore" at Aarons.
It is a niche rod, and it is designed to quickly defeat the bright King....Or for presenting into serious beach enviornments.
A few seasons ago I was asked by the folks at Nakia lodge on the Lower Dean to design a rod or two for presenting shooting heads to their Bright Springers.
They primarily wanted a few rods that would minimize the possibility of exhausting the very Bright King early in its journey.
....Very feisty fish at that stage, but still prone to be easily exhausted if fought with too light of tackle.
Thus the 13x13 ~ 4 pc and the 13x10/11 ~ 3 pc.
The 13X13 is a shooting head rod.
It will deliver two hands on the overhead no worries, and once you've got your timing down will Skagit family cast quite well....Perry poke tips etc.
It will be tip loading at around 550 grains or so and will require 1200 grains to get deep into the butt reserve.
It is admittedly not the greatest long belly classic delivery distance rod.
At only 13 ft in length.....Requireing 1000 grains + to butt load....It will not easily carry more then 80/90 feet of aerialized long belly line.
At least I sure have a hard time doing it !!!
But it will RIP a shooting head more then a fair distance with ease.
.....And that is what the rod was originally asked to do: Deliver extreme tip systems into fluctuating water levels to holding fish, at short to mid distances. Then quickly defeat the fish.
I do like the SA short belly Spey (50 ft) 12/13 for this rod. These are great lines to mess around with....Add compensators, and built T14 tips etc.
....And the Rio for 11/12/13 has lots of cool options.
The base line is 900 grains or so....And the overall belly length is still short enough to be manageable.
With a modified mid section and Big Boy Dredgers (or built up tips) it can set up as a very versitile interchangeable tip shooting head line.
I've not tried the new Rio Scan lines.....But they seem to be the reincarnation or adabtation of the same shooting heads that they offered several years ago ? So the 800 grain + heads should work just fine as base lines.
I also like the Guideline 50 foot shooting heads on this rod.....Hard to get them here now.
At any rate Dana....A very accurate comparison when comparing the 13X13 to the single handed Blue water fly rod....Good on ya.
Although, if the 13X13 is built as a "Transformer" it also becomes an awesome 10'6" ~ 12/13 weight 3 pc. two handed blue water "switch rod".
Throwing two handed roll casts to teased bills is kinda fun.
Dana - yes I intend using it on the Dean for Chinook with short belly speys or a head system - I found that 8 days of slinging 18- 24' of LC-13 on a midspey & my 10150-4 to be quiet the work out! Coming from a background of saltwater fishing of the tip of Africa I find the 15' length to be too long to get the Chinook in, in the timeframe I would prefer for what is essentialy a catch an release fishery.Yes this is a niche rod, but for what a fishery! There has been little posted on this board about this rod so I felt it was time to start a thread - I will update this thread with my own experiences down the line.
Bob, once again many thanks for your input.
I think I'm in line for a demo of the 13x13 to do some evaluation for a possible billy off the rocks. I've got a SA T120 competition line, and Bruce reckons that if I cut 13 feet of it, it should fit the 13x13 quite nicely for testing purposes. The b/s is low and its not as tough as army boots but for casting testing it should be fine.
You might be able toi get a Loop adaptive in 11/12 to work on it as well.
Its about the right length for off the rocks ocean fly cassting, and should handle small billies right smartly. Anywat the billfish season is about over at Jervis Bay in NSW so Ill have to think about here in October November. But it seems to be in the right ball park for ocean rock fly fishing for those nasties. The only problem might be getting a suitable reel with the right capacity for large pelagics. Maybe a OF 5" Nautilus with no holes to increase weight to get the correct balance. Cherrs Max
What is a T120? I assume this is one of the Scientific Anglers lines? When I get the rod I will be trying a windcutter 11/12/13, primarily to spey cast as I think it might be a bit long for overhead casting. One of Bob's friends is going to set up the rod with a head and Rio T14 tips backed with 50lb slick shooter - I will probibaly try this system as well as I feel it may be better suited to overhead casting - will keep you posted.I fish a Bauer M7 on my bigger rods, if you loaded it with a head system and used gelspun backing I would imagine you should be able to get 600-900m on the reel - this should at least get you into the ballpark with beakies! I have 300m 50lb "Tough Stuff" + 100m 30lb dacron under my midspey10/11 on this reel.
A SA T120 is a heavy competition line. like 120 grams and 16.5 metres. Its designed for 16 plus feet double handed overhead competition casting. It has a 20lb breaking strain and isn't designed for fishing but it would be great to evaluate the rod. Overall its 1851 gns and you can cut it to fit a 13X13 by removing some 10/13 feet. I would squeeze Bruce and get a T120 just to find out how it does do the overhead thing. I have a Loop 12'4" blackline in 8/9 and I use T40's on that. The line is 16.5 metres and 40 grams, That is 54 feet and 625 gns and the Blackline loves it.
Its a tungsten line, very thin and a Type!V sinker. Quite fast sink.
Bob calls this thing a 13# but at the load figure it's more like a 3oz device, like 1300 gns, or at least a 2.5 ounce device, and that is some load for a fly rod, DH or not. Max
I worked with this Rod for a couple of months off and on.
I must say this is quite a Serious Piece of Graphite
Found it would tip load at around 750 Grains and butt load at 1200 grains.
I like casting it a around 900 grains for most situations.
Never did get a chance to fish it but I would lay odds that it would handle anything in fresh water and most fish in the Salt with in reason.
The beauty of the rod was the progressive mid section which was quite smooth very little recoil.
This made you forget the fact that you casting a 1000 grains of line.
Rod like this will not tire you out during long casting session.
I was doing both.
I think with proper line you could turn over a big boy up to 400 grains with no problem.
I used a 11/12/13 Windcutter for the short head and for overhead I used the same line with the center section out.
Played with a 11/12 Standard Delta also for the over head.
750 grains seemed to be about ideal for overhead work
Have tried to use lighter heads for the overhead and with will cast a mile but has not in heavy wind.
The line of choice for me was a 11/12 Midspey for spey casting.
As for speycasting you could launch a Chevy truck with it
I really think that you could build a launcher line to cast up to 700 grain heads.
I have no reason to do it myself even for Chinook fishing.
Hope this helps
Well I promised to update this post with my experiences - I have just returned from 7 days of chasing chinook with this rod.I used primarily 26 feet of a 11/12 scandanavian head to launch 18 - 21 feet of T-14 as well as the middle airflow custom tip (20' @ 9.5 ips) the resultant line/head is spey cast and an additional 20 to 40 feet of running line can be shot. I also overhead cast a 850g DWE a good +120' - this was however a little too fast a sink rate for most of the water I fished. This rod handles chinook rather well, with a 27lb chromer beached inside of 15 min!This rod is somewhat beefy and might be too much for someone of slight stature(I am 6'3.5") I did also try Meiz's 13' 9/10/11 3p and would strongly recomend it for some one wanting a lighter casting rod yet strong enough for chinook
Chinook have very tough mouths - if you set the hook into the bone I do not beleive you can apply too much presure, if however you do not penetrate the bone you often pick up a sliver of skin and exesive pressure will result in a lost fish, I beleive that most of these fish will be lost anyway and probibaly account for the 2/3 fish that are often lost in the long battles that ensue with these powerfull fish - occasionaly I land a chinook with the hook holding on by a sliver of skin, this is generaly with the smaller fish and almost never with the +20lb fish.
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