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chrome-magnon man
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1. What's your definition of a Trout Spey?

2. Do you actually use them for trout on a regular basis? ("I tried them once" and " I fish them for steelhead on the Deschutes" don't count)

3. What methods do you use?

4. Do you Spey cast to rising fish? (a roll cast pick up into an overhead cast doesn't count)
 

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Here we go again!
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Definition? A spey rod scaled down to trout sized game and lines, capable of performing standard spey casts.

I have Meiser's 12'6" 4/5/6 and line it with a Hardy Mach 1 Plus 8/9 or an Airflo Delta 8/9 single hand line when fishing short or fishing nymphs. I've yet to use it on any small to medium trout waters, but will be very soon. It is used for casting to half pounders, juvenile steelhead that run from 16" to maybe 25". My home river has a good summer population of these. I fished the Meiser proto a lot last summer (along with his 11'4" and 11'7" rods) throwing caddis dries (either dead drifting or skating) in the evenings on a long line and the fish put a good bend in the rod. We also do well tossing big beadheaded rubberlegged nymphs (size 10 stones) and the Delta line with a 5' sinking poly leader and 5 feet of flourocarbon tippet works well.
I am throwing spey casts only, fishing the Delta line with snap T's and working out to the full head (43'). With the Hardy line single spey casts from hand to fly of 90 feet are a breeze. Using a Loop 3W. Most of the fishing is slowly swinging nymphs or high sticking through slots, but in the evenings just before dusk casting dries to spotted fish is the way to go.

Seeing a lot of Gary andersons 13' 5 weight on the river lately too. Nice rod there also.

I've fished the south fork of the Snake several times and I know these will be awesome on rivers like that. Hoping to get up there this summer.
 

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It's interesting that you bring this up. I was just thinking about ultralight 2 handed rods this morning in the shower. (I do all my best thinking in the shower. :whoa: It's where I get all my crazy ideas.)

I wasn't thinking about the standard 12'6" 6 wt 2 handed rod. I was thinking a lot lighter. I have 2 rods are riding around in the trunk of my car. I do all my fishing with them. A 12'6" 6 wt 2 handed rod and a 9' 4 wt single handed rod. In comparison the line the 2 handed rod throws is HUGE. When compared to the line on the 4 wt single handed rod, I feel like I'm throwing a 10 wt line. I got to thinking about what a 2 handed rod would be like made with a 9 or 9'6" 4 wt blank. :Eyecrazy: That is a trout rod.

There are 10'6" switch rods but what about a true lightweight 2 handed rod? You could fish it single handed or 2 handed when you need to make a spey cast.

To be honest I don't consider a 12'6" 6 wt 2 handed rod a trout rod. I consider it lightweight saltwater tackle.

Because of how short the rod is you may also have to make the lower handle a little shorter than normal. The upper cork may need to be a little short too. Or possibly 2 seperate setions. (Has anyone thougth about leaving smallish gaps between the cork in a handle so that the handle doesn't interfere with the action as much? It probably wouldn't look as nice a full cork, but the action would be better. I think)

So once you make this ultralight 2 handed rod how do you design a line for it? You aren't going to find a production line to fit it. I'd guess you'd start with DT5 (DT6?) and DT3 line to make a head and then attach the smallest shooting line you can find as running line. Although you may even want to use 30# backing as running line.

I guess that's enough crazy ideas for now...
 

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Trout SPey

I actually use a spey rod for trout quite a bit now that I have found a couple that really fit the bill. The new Winston Boron II rods make a nice trout spey as well as the sage 5wt. I also believe Meiser has a couple versions as well as some switch rods that would fit the bill nicely! I use short belly lines such as the WC etc. Most of the time I am either swinging streamers or skating dries for trout as well as smallies! Took a spey rod to the Big Horn in Montana and loved it. Hade more fun with that than I did with the one hander! So much fishing to do and so little time! :Eyecrazy:
 

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swing'n Lemmings
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As much as I can

I love mine. I have the Loomis Metloius 5/6 13ft 4in Trout spey. I use that rod to pratice with because it will not let me muscle the cast(big problem I have) any how I do a a lot of switch casting with mine down on the lake for bass and big gills. Spiral singal speys, snap t and variations. snake roll and Perry Pokes.
As soon as work slows down here I should have a bit of time off here and I planning on doing some Hopper fishing with it and swinging wet flies streamers and bead head soft hackles. if I were not working 14 hrs a day right now I would be throwing Hexigenia Drys on it. they are just starting to pop here in Michigan.

Rambo
 

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Hey Dana,

I like this topic...};^) !!!

There is no doubt an excellent selection of light-in-the hand two handers available to the angler now that are suitable for Trouting.

Like Kush and others have said: There really is no such thing as a bad "Spey Rod" <> Just improperly lined ones.

I agree with that 100%, and do especially agree with that in regards to Trouting with the two hander, as the lines required for the diversity of Trouting can be very specific.

I think that by nature; Trout fishing can far more technique oriented, and diverse when compared to classic swing fishing commonly associated with Salmon and Steelhead.

Through any given day, the Trouter may apply several different fly presentation techniques, and specific lines to meet these presentations:

With the proper full floater, the two handed Trouter will not only be able to greaseline swing wets and swing/lift soft hackles <> But will also be able to high stick weighted nymphs, indicator fish weighted nymphs, dead drift dries, skate or hitch top water surface bugs, up-stream strip weighted minnow patterns, downstream feed weighted minnow patterns into undercuts....on and on.

Then there's the Trouter that may wish to use sink tips, or shooting head tip systems rather then weighted flies to get down into holding water <> Another whole ball game, and lot's of various techniques can be applied with these lines as well.

..... All while switching from flies that will imitate any variety of adult, emerging, or larval insects. Plus baitfish, crustations, leeches, snails, mice, whatever.

There is also the diversity of size for Trout/Char themselves:

Everything from 6" brush creek tiddlers in our headwaters <> Dolly's, Cutty's, Bull's, Brookies, Brownies, and Bows holding in our bigger waters in the 1.5 to 10 pound plus range....All the way to our 20 pound plus tailwater, and lake borne Browns and Bows.

Off the shelf labeled "Spey Lines" will generally begin in the 350 grain range....With their belly tapers and running lines best suited for swing fishing only.

Lines begining at 350 +- grains is a lot of grain for many Trouty presentaions, and the diverse requirements of many Trouters will require line tapers and running lines that will fish far beyond the classic side step swing presentations associated with Steelheading.

...But there are many single hand fly line options available with the inherent grain distribution within their tapers to effectively perform classic two handed change-of-direction deliveries on the very lightweight two handers, plus have running line diameters suitable for line mending the various nymphing techniques, and dead drift presentations associated with Trouting <> With many of these lines under 200 grains.

These lighter grained lines will allow finesse deliveries for the two handed Trouter, and also protect the very fine tippets often required for clear water, or small fly Trouting with the 3 to 5 wt two hander.

In all honesty...There is no doubt that the Trout angler can accomplish just about anything with the classic 9' 6 wt single hand fly rod, utilizing single hand spey deliveries.

....Just as one could do with most any lightweight two hander.

I will do this myself all day with my favorite 7'9" 3 wt. single hand rod: Single hand spey while fishing micro high desert spring creeks for Redsides, or small Coastal brushy Cutty creeks etc.

...But if I'm even close to being on Trout waters large enough that I feel will warrant the use of the two hander ?....Man I'm all over that.

Not really because I need to <> More like I want to because it's really fun, and often time very productive...};^)...!!!

Meiz
 

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My first Spey Rod, my Sage 7136 was used for trout on the Yuba, American and Putah Creek in California. I lob cast flies under indicators, switch cast to surfacing trout and spey casted on the Yuba and wider parts of Putah Creek. The Trout taken on the Yuba and in Putah Creek went to 5-6 pounds. The 7136 reached out and touched some red sides in the Deschutes that I could never touch with a one handed rod.

The following year I bought Meise's 5/6 Switch rod. I use the Rio WC 5/6 with it. I can't really spey cast with that short of a rod, but it switch casts, roll casts and parachute casts like a dream. I use all of my old 5 & 6 weight trout lines with this rod.

Last year, I bought my Sage 6126, and I have used it for trout in N California and SW Oregon. I can spey cast it, cast tips, cast dry flies, hoppers, my hand tied Yellow Jacket flies (dry and wet), switch cast it and spey cast streamers with it. It is too much rod for a one to two pound trout and great for the 3-6 pound trout.

This week, my Sage 5120 will be arriving from Gary Anderson. I will use it for trout where the 6126 is too much of a rod. Also, since I torn my right bicep, even the 6126 is too much rod for my old right arm to handle. I hope to find a line to Skagit cast with it.

If we only use our Spey Rods in N California for steelhead and salmon, we have many months of nothing to cast to. The trout speys are a great alternative and option.
 

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12' 4wt

I purchased a rod at a benefit auction this winter made by Gary Anderson. It has five sections: 1 two-handed butt section, 1 single hand butt section, 2 center sections, and 1 tip. You can join the sections to form either a 12' 4wt spey rod or a 9' 6wt single hand rod. They both cast a 6wt Wulff triangle taper beautifully. I use the spey exclusively for trout on my favorite trout river, the Deschutes, and have a big casting and mending advantage over a single hand rod.
 

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Just started. I had an old GLoomis IM6 13 foot float rod collecting dust. It was used when I lived in Ontario. After seeing the new Dredger series I noticed it had a similar action. So I removed all the components and rebuilt it as a spey rod. My guess is that it's a 5/6 weight. I tried an 8wt DT and an 8 wt steelhead taper but they were both too heavy. After Riveraddict's posts on the Skagit style and mini speys I figured I'd go that direction. I have a mini Skagit head 38' and 409 gr. I've been hitting the Cowichan with it and a 15" brown or rainbow can really double this light rod over. The system is really well balanced and I can easily cast over 70'. Thus far I've just used it to swing muddlers and other streamer patterns. I bet it would be great for swinging caddis pupa during the hatches. I can't wait for those pink salmon to show up later this summer! I've got a trip to the Bow booked for next month and I can't wait to swing some big streamers there too. :smokin:
 

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Peter,
It had a stiffer butt section than many of my other float rods. I don't think it would be very good with a longer belly line but it sure likes the shooting head system. It throws very tight loops. I can even put the 8wt type 8 tip on it and cast it no problem. I think if I still lived on the Beaver this would be my rod of choice for the fall steelie season.
 

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Interesting question:)- I found myself doing a spey " what on earth is he all excited about" demo at the regional Trout Festival the other week. Bear in mind these are lake/tubing fishers for the most part. What really got their attention was a simple lift/spiral setup with a change of direction as a fast easy means of covering rising fish from a single postion, as well as the obvious ease and energy efficient means it was acheived, maybe the question could be "what are usefull tranferable spey casts into other areas" versus" what is a trout spey(rod)" :)))
My exploration of lightweight spey is aimed at chasing Goldeye and Whitefish in a river with some of the most amazing hatches of stones/caddis/mayflies i,ve ever seen:))) so nymphing/dry work/wet flies etc etc

Will
 

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chrome-magnon man
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Discussion Starter #12
Stamp,

when are you going to the Bow?

Bob added a wrinkle that I wasn't even thinking about, a detailed look at single hand spey applications. I was thinking about two-handers but of course the single handers work. Could we make an actual two-handed 6wt 9-1/2ft rod that would cast a standard 6 or 7 weight line? You could of course cast it single handed, but why?
 

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Junkyard Spey
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Hey Dana...

All I know is "trout speys" are HOT, HOT, HOT, :whoa:
 

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I've probably posted this before, but...my kids first rod was just such a short trout 'spey'.

My kids' first rod was given to them when they were around 6 or 7, after my son asked for a rod for Christmas. Knowing that young kids like things that are big to make them feel grown-up, I built a mini-2 hander.

I used a moderate action 9-foot blank, and the guys at Anglers Workshop let me scrounge through the scraps until I found an appropriate piece of graphite to shove in the butt to lenthen it a bit for the lower cork. The finished rod is a 9.5 foot 4 weight. I should find a long-belly 6 weight for the spey casting; I wasn't smart enough to try that when the rod was built, although I did overline it with a 5 to help the kids.

Such a rod provided 2 advantages for kids--they could cast relatively safely, since spey casting is usually safer than overhead, and it is impossible for a young kid to overcast much, especially a long rod, anyway. Plus, the lower cork made a fighting butt, which is necessary for young kids because their small hands and weak wrist can't put much torque into a single hand rod.

It still is a lovely traditional action rod that is fun to fish. I'm tempted to cut off the lower cork, but I can't bring myself to do it; too many memories.

--Bill
 

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chrome-magnon man
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Discussion Starter #15
Bill,

I remember you telling me about this at the Sandy Clave--cool! I made a Spey out of a Sage RPL 8100 by attaching a long screw in fighting butt--this of course wasn't a trout spey but the same kind of idea. LOOP now makes 11ft 3 and 4 weights that cast great overhead and I've been toying with having one made into a two-hander.
 

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Trout Spey lines

I have found that the RIO clouser line makes a great skagit casting line when using smaller trout speys or switch rods. You can add Poly leaders in the 5ft and 10ft lengths for sink tips and it works extremely well. The key is to get the correct WT clouser line to load the rod properly. So far it seems that you need to go 2-3 WT's up in line for most applications. So a 6 wt trout spey rod would require an 8 or 9 wt clouser line to get the correct load on the rod. I have tried this on a couple of spey or switch rods so far and I am extremly happy with the results for skagit style casting. Plus if you decide to overhead cast it works great as well and the line has plenty of ability to turn over a sink tip as well as some pretty large streamers.
 
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