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BBCT
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Discussion Starter · #21 ·
So, way more input than I was expecting :) thank you all.

Different things to think about and try out.

Cheers,
Chris
 

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How much overhang are you working with? Rather than try to buy more heads try working with some overhang to overcome the wind. I would bet with .75m or maybe a little more you can generate a little more line speed on the forward stroke to tighten things up and punch it into the wind a little better.
This is a great point! Unfortunately you don’t see this good advice given that much. Regardless of the line if you aren’t messing with the overhang you may be leaving some performance on the table. As you lengthen the overhang it will help more and more to create a tight loop. At some point it will become either TOO tight for comfort, or too difficult to pull off the cast. The right amount depends on the line, rod and personal stroke style. You can view it as a tool, or as a mere crutch to correct things if you are a hardcore “purist”. Either way it works. A good exercise to understand what is happening is to make a few casts with no overhang, then add 6”. Rinse and repeat until you are unable to cast it anymore. Someone with regular skills can usually reach 5 or 6 feet - but you will feel yourself having to tighten up the precision of your cast as you go, which by itself can be revealing. That can give you a great idea of the trade offs - most individuals will feel there is a sweet spot for them, and the particular line and rod.

But a tighter loop will help in wind, however you can manage it. The weight of the line will increase the momentum but the air drag goes up too, all other things being equal, like the wt to the 2/3 power. So without the tight loop it can be like two steps forward and one step back.
 

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Beulah Burkheimer Meiser
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This is a great point! Unfortunately you don’t see this good advice given that much. Regardless of the line if you aren’t messing with the overhang you may be leaving some performance on the table. As you lengthen the overhang it will help more and more to create a tight loop. At some point it will become either TOO tight for comfort, or too difficult to pull off the cast. The right amount depends on the line, rod and personal stroke style. You can view it as a tool, or as a mere crutch to correct things if you are a hardcore “purist”. Either way it works. A good exercise to understand what is happening is to make a few casts with no overhang, then add 6”. Rinse and repeat until you are unable to cast it anymore. Someone with regular skills can usually reach 5 or 6 feet - but you will feel yourself having to tighten up the precision of your cast as you go, which by itself can be revealing. That can give you a great idea of the trade offs - most individuals will feel there is a sweet spot for them, and the particular line and rod.

But a tighter loop will help in wind, however you can manage it. The weight of the line will increase the momentum but the air drag goes up too, all other things being equal, like the wt to the 2/3 power. So without the tight loop it can be like two steps forward and one step back.
Your reply post was very well presented (and I think we expect that from you on some level). One mans tool is another mans crutch but I find being able to use overhang on demand when needed is a very productive tool to have in your tool box. I think its valuable to practice using it for when you need it. I was out at my gator filled pond this morning practicing overhang casting with a Gaelforce 63 8/9 on my Burkie 14'3" 8/9/10 (and using Kruk's leader formula) and I was maxing out with about four feet of overhang. It was tough to get it all to happen but when it did it was tight. I hooked my tip guide a couple times but when it worked it was kinda fun to watch from the driver seat. With that said practice each rod head combo with some overhang incase you need it.
 

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Enough overhang can also sometimes turn something very clunky on the other end of the spectrum - like a snake roll on a skagit head with a heavy tip - into something much closer to, if not quite elegance.
 

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"Regardless of the line if you aren’t messing with the overhang you may be leaving some performance on the table."

I was given this advice from an instructor about a year or so ago, and it has proven so true for me. I don't cast anything longer than some aeroheads, but this tip has made casting life so much easier and fun, at least with the scandi lines.
 

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Beulah Burkheimer Meiser
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Enough overhang will change your timing quite a bit and I think you will need your d loop a little further behind you. I also find enough overhang will allow you to cast lines much lighter than your rod might be rated for. :cool: My journey over the past year has been longer heads, lighter heads, and longer rods. Its a fun journey.
 

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So, way more input than I was expecting :) thank you all.

Different things to think about and try out.

Cheers,
Chris
For what it is worth I have always fished and set that rod up for demos with an Elixir Switch 350 or a Tonic Switch 400. Did you arrive at the Elixir Switch 325 by accident as in that is the first line you went with or via preference? 350 loads the rod a tad deeper yet does not cause any lack in recovery time or tip acting like a drunk sailor. It also goes drastically better in windy conditions as well as carrying better distance. Anyway, lots of lines will work but that also might have bearing on which Rage size you purchase. BB~
 

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For what it is worth I have always fished and set that rod up for demos with an Elixir Switch 350 or a Tonic Switch 400. Did you arrive at the Elixir Switch 325 by accident as in that is the first line you went with or via preference? 350 loads the rod a tad deeper yet does not cause any lack in recovery time or tip acting like a drunk sailor. It also goes drastically better in windy conditions as well as carrying better distance. Anyway, lots of lines will work but that also might have bearing on which Rage size you purchase. BB~
Bruce,
Naive question here....besides the difference in length between the Elixir vs. Elixir switch, is there much difference in the taper for same grain weight heads?? For instance, in the Airflo lineup, the rage having a slightly more stout front end than the scandi compact. thus, the advocates for the rage in windier conditions
 

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BBCT
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199 Posts
Discussion Starter · #29 ·
For what it is worth I have always fished and set that rod up for demos with an Elixir Switch 350 or a Tonic Switch 400. Did you arrive at the Elixir Switch 325 by accident as in that is the first line you went with or via preference? 350 loads the rod a tad deeper yet does not cause any lack in recovery time or tip acting like a drunk sailor. It also goes drastically better in windy conditions as well as carrying better distance. Anyway, lots of lines will work but that also might have bearing on which Rage size you purchase. BB~
I thought that was the recommendation on the web site. I might have to go back and look at the really, really small print on the line to see what I have.

Cheers,
Chris
 

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BBCT
Joined
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199 Posts
Discussion Starter · #30 ·
Enough overhang will change your timing quite a bit and I think you will need your d loop a little further behind you. I also find enough overhang will allow you to cast lines much lighter than your rod might be rated for. :cool: My journey over the past year has been longer heads, lighter heads, and longer rods. Its a fun journey.
Using a completely different rod over the last couple of days I did some playing with overhang. It definitely required different timing and it also changed the cast. Gave me something to mess around with while the fishing was slow.

Cheers,
Chris
 
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