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Discussion Starter #1
Hi.

I came across with the REC's RECOIL rings a while surfin' in the web last year. Does anyone have any experience with these? They are made from the same material that some eyglass frames that you can bend like hell and then warm them up and... voilá. They're like new again! Oh... almost forgot; the material of these rings is NiTi, which is a shape memory alloy.

The guides, snakes and top rings that I have on my rods are SiC, chrome, TiC and TiN. I think the best from these are the TiNs but the golden color doesn't suit every rod. The TiC (the same that GLoomis uses) kind of combined whistling and screeking sound. They also seem to have high friction (or it's just the sound that makes me think so). The sound is there only with shooting head/normal line but disappears with mono running line.

I'd like to test those titanium rings too if they really diminish freezing. Are these durable and does the line run in these without extra sounds and with ease?

Since I haven't (yet) tested the RECOIL or titanium rings I would go for the TiN rings if they suit the blank color.

This is what I think. The rings on the rod may not be the most imortant thing but what do you think? Which is the best material and why?

*Waitin' for the rivers to loose their icy tops.*
 

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Hi SMS,
I used the Recoil guides on one of my rods last year. A local rod builder that worked at a shop I used to frequent (when I lived outside of Atlanta) used them on a Loomis blank; he showed me the bending feature and I thought, "Hey, that's really cool!". The "unbreakable" feature is the selling point, but I can't say that I'm too impressed with these guides when it comes to other aspects. For instance, I don't like the look of them mounted on the blank; they seem to sit tilted to one side, which may be due to some negligence of mine while wrapping, though I'm not so certain because it appeared to me that the wires were a bit "off" where they join back together (these are single-foot guides, btw). I should have stopped right there and used different guides but, regrettably, I didn't. Rod appearance is a major deal to me, and I've used nothing but TiCH guides in the past; I'll be using them on a T & T rod project starting this week. The recoil guides just don't look as good as heavier guides to me.

That brings up another point: I believe that Recoil guides are billed as the lightest available, but who really cares? We're talking about a difference in overall rod weight (comparing one rod built with Recoils and the other with "standard" guides) so minimal that I doubt anyone could tell the difference.

The last point: I've had rods for years that have been fished up and down the coast, travelled by land, air, and sea, and none of them has ever suffered a broken guide. I've carried them assembled and hiked up and down steep, slippery hill sides, fallen into streams and rivers, etc., and again the record is unblemished. So, are the Recoil guides really "all that"?

This may not be the info you were looking for, but I hope it helps...
 

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Discussion Starter #3 (Edited)
Hi Chris.

Couple of my friends have bend their snakes useless. They've just notised that a snake is twisted and unreiparable. I have only once destroyed a ring but since it was a guide ring recoils wouldn't have changed a thing since I always use ceramic guides. Btw, it was the lowest guide on my 15´GLX and was crushed between the car door and body. Man, was I frightened when that happened but when I saw it was just a ring I was unbelievably relieved.

About the TiCH rings (the ones loomis used/uses on GLX rods), TiCH is actually TiC if there's no extra hydrogen in the combination. Haven't you noticed the awful sound while line runs out looesely? It's like screeching a blackboard. These "gunsmoke" rings do that, at least in my rod. That's why I took the TiN rings the last time. No extra sounds and the friction seem to better. TiC is a little harder material than TiN but I think that TiN's friction against a flyline is lower.

Maybe I'll test next the rings that have DLC (diamond like coating). I think that fly products that Fuji sells are made by Seymo. At least the snakes etc. on Fuji's pages are said to be Seymo. Hopkins and Holloway are mentioned too. In the H&H's web pages there are practically all kinds of Seymo rings with coatings like TiN, DLC (black diamond or sometimes mistakenly referred as black titanium nitride), TiC and HC (hard chrome).

Those DLC rings would be great for high speed fish and dirty lines. I must have been mad because I didn't take these for my latest rod. Gotta get a new blanck and...

-Sakari-
 

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Sakari -
You apparently know much more about guides than I do. The TiCH guides I was referring to were advertised as just that, so I was unaware of the difference in material. I can't say that I've ever noticed any "abnormal" sound from shooting line or fast-running fish; I wonder if this is partly a factor of the types of line and backing being used.

Chris
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Well, I'm almost master of science in technology (my thesis is almost ready) and materials science is my field...

Anyway, I don't know if the sound is related to the lines that much since wether I use Loop, SA, Vision, Guideline or Rio, the sound is always there. It doesn't matter if the line is floating or hits the bottom like a rock.

The rings are marketed as TiCH gunsmoke and are said to be the same as on GLXs. If they really are "TiCH" they should be referred as Ti-C:H or titanium-containing amorphous hydrocarbon :eyecrazy: but NOT merely titanium carbide. The latter seems to be the name so it is quite confusing what they really are... Marketing is most likely to blame here for the name confusion. Maybe I should take one and have a look at it with SEM and do an analysis. But first I should get rights to use the instrument and don't know when I have time for that.

The sound shouldn't be due to the placement of the rings since they are all in the places that loomis recommends and are of the same size except for the lowest guide which is larger for shootability.

The sound occurs only (can't really remember if does it in otherwise) when I try to get line out. Leader and some line in the water -> I pull some line from the reel and swing the rod back to get line out using water's resistance. That's when the sound tortures my ears.

Maybe I just have bad luck and its a resonance effect.

Next time I'll get those Hopkins&Holloway/Seymo DLC rings. If they're good I'll probably stick with them on my future rods and maybe I'll replace the titanium carbide (or the Ti-C:H) rings too.

Btw, I noticed (while tracking down what loomis use in their rods) that some loomises have recoils on them :)
 

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I have heard from a few bamboo building friends of mine that the flexible nature of the Recoil guides will pinch a fly line when the rod is bent. Now I have never seen this in person, and I do not know if this was theory or observance on the part of my friends, so this could be in fact a bunch of BS. But maybe not.

It is my opinion that any reduction in weight on the rod blank can only benefit how a rod casts, as less weight on the blank itself will enable the rod to rebound faster, and track straighter, thus producing a crisper and more accurate rod. How much weight it takes to make a difference is unknown to me, but I am sure it isn't much. I have bent guides in the past, but this has happened very infrequently. What does all of this add up too? I don't know!!!
 

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Noisy Rod Rings/Guides

When casting Loomis fly rods, I have also noticed screeching noises caused by friction between fly line and single-foot rod guides. I solved this problem by cleaning and lubricating the fly line. Personally, I like to use "Glide" fly line dressing made by Umpqua. This definitely seems to reduce friction and increase shootability of the fly line. However, there are probably other products that might also work. Although I have not tried it yet, I have heard that "303 Protectant" is also good for fly lines.
 

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sms,

The only time I have heard the sound you describe when fishing my Loomis GLX 13 ft 8/9 wt was when I tried a GrandSpey 8/9 on it. The rod cast the line well enough; however, the line guides were not large enough to allow the line to freely pass through them. Hence the screeching sound you describe. As soon as I changed to a different line, the screeching sound vanished. I would like to see Loomis put larger running guides on all of their 2-hand rods to facilitate using out modern mid- and long-belly lines on them.
 

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I wonder how many people are really using Loomis rods on the forum. Seems like the majority are using Sage, Loop, CND, Meiser, and T & T (not necessarily in that order) when it comes to two-handed sticks. I can't get past all the hype about Loomis rods; seems like there are better brands out there for the same price, or less in some cases.
 

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Chris,

I made the decision to buy the GLX 13 ft 8/9 after trying many different rods when I bought it 6 years ago. It was the fastest 13 ft 8/9 on the market then and still is today and it has the fast-progressive action that I like. I also really like the GLX 15 ft 10/11 but bought the T&T 1611 7 years ago because it was a foot longer and had a bit more butt strength and power, although it is slightly slower than the GLX 15 ft 10/11.

In short, I like the GLX 2-handers; however, I like the T&T more than the GLX's except for the 13' 8/9 and the 15' 10/11 (the T&T 1511 is the equivalent T&T model). Don't get me wrong, I like the 1309 and 1511 T&T's very much, I just like the slightly quicker GLX's in those sizes a little bit better. Perhaps that is why I own both T&T and GLX rods.
 

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Hmm. I don't see many two-handed Loomis rods on the racks around here. Tightlines in North Jersey carries some of their single-handed rods, but most of the two-handed models are Loop and now CND. I'm all for the fast-action, as you know, though for overhead casting.
 
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