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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
New to the two hand game and I'm reading conflicting things regarding tips for skagit lines. On Rio's site, it says I don't need a tip. On others, it says I absolutely do. I have a dually 8119 enroute in the mail and a skagit extreme intermediate 480 along with running line. Will be casting larger saltwater flies, with overhead casting. Any insight would be appreciated, thanks.
 

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FISHIN' FREELANCER
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The SA Intermediate are already fairly fine up front in comparison to many other skagits. Just being Intermediate density lessens the diameter. You can always tame it down a bit (if desired) by playing with leader options / lengths. Poly's can be a good plan here, different lengths, densities, and cores.
 

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Wow! Am I missing something? You said new to two handed game but then state you're going to overhand cast, which is single-handed?

So you're planning to overhand cast a large saltwater fly with a 480gr head on an 11ft 8wt rod? That's a workout, for sure. I'd try it first before buying more gear. Add another 65-110 grain tip and you can cancel your gym membership!
 

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If it is only 22ft head it casts very bad without tip. It straightens very aggressively when you do back cast and false casts and line tip overshoots. When you shoot long cast the line loop unfurls very fast and usually it begins another line loop cycle in the air and line lands so that rear is furthest out and fly closer. With heavy at least 10ft tip (preferably tapered) it behaves better.

Esa
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Wow! Am I missing something? You said new to two handed game but then state you're going to overhand cast, which is single-handed.

So you're planning to overhand cast a large saltwater fly with a 480gr head on an 11ft 8wt rod? That's a workout, for sure. I'd try it first before buying more gear. Add another 65-110 grain tip and you can cancel your gym membership!
You can most certainly cast two handed overhead, it's been discussed on this forum in detail plenty of times. But I thank you for your concern.


So does anyone have a recommendation for a tip? The sink rates on these things seem pretty extreme.
 

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You don't need a sink tip. But you may want to use a longer mono leader for better anchoring if you are spey casting. When I'm fishing the beach I typically use a type 6 10' with my rio intermediate skagit to keep the line under the wave turbulence. Could go shorter if there's less waves and current. Maybe heavier in bigger waves deeper delivery. Your situations will vary so have fun with the versatility of the 2 hander.
I don't like to overhead cast and worry about who or what's behind me every time I cast. But if you do overhead, most people like to line on the lighter side and not use skagits typically from what I've read.
I do like shorter heads so I can strip all the way in and often catch fish within 30'

Best of luck!
Kevin
 

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You can most certainly cast two handed overhead, it's been discussed on this forum in detail plenty of times. But I thank you for your concern.


So does anyone have a recommendation for a tip? The sink rates on these things seem pretty extreme.
Seems your recomendation so far is you need a tip, you don't need a tip.

I've never come across a discussion involving two handed overhand casting. I assumed it was single handed, so pardon my ignorance on this form of casting, I don't do beach. And now there's talk of "anchoring". Is there a YouTube video of someone casting two handed overhand and "anchoring" thier cast, like you plan, just curious to see this.

BTW, didn't mean to offend, but you still might want to consider tuning down your tone for your 5th post.
 

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FISHIN' FREELANCER
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That's a good point bender, agree for the most part. This "Will be casting larger saltwater flies" is one variance though. Fishing a straight Skagit head is not all that uncommon with big flies and big wind, also there was a kayak mentioned in another thread.

FTT; search on "surf two hand overhead" you'll hit a lot of vids
 

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I would reread it again, there is a big difference of overhead and overhand. Think before your type!!!!

Just love being a pain in the butt and making a person feel like crap!


Wow! Am I missing something? You said new to two handed game but then state you're going to overhand cast, which is single-handed.

So you're planning to overhand cast a large saltwater fly with a 480gr head on an 11ft 8wt rod? That's a workout, for sure. I'd try it first before buying more gear. Add another 65-110 grain tip and you can cancel your gym membership!
 

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Interesting thread. I live on the west coast and overhead cast all the time in the salt as do most others using double-handed rods. I use smaller flies so don't use a Skagit line, but I know of lots of folks fishing the Atlantic who fish using Skagits. I would definately use either a floating or intermediate tip (more if necessary) but would also scale down the weight of my Skagit as they are not designed to be good OH casting tools.
Most of the fishers on here don't fish using OH casts, and some, by virtue of where they live find it to be a foreign concept. For more info on usinf Skagits for OH casting check out the archives here, or go to Stripers on line. Lots of the fishers on the later site mentioned use long double-handed rods and Skagits for casting large flies to stripers. Worth checking out.
 

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One of the guys who did a presentation at the casting event that I went to this past weekend had some home made lines that he used to overhead cast with two handers, 12 and 13 weight single hand shooting heads welded to coated running lines. They were nearly effortless to cast 100+ feet on 14 foot 9 weight rods. Not exactly the setup you have, but it was pretty cool to cast them. A 10 or 11 weight single hand head looped on to your running line would probably achieve similar results. Or maybe something like a Rio outbound or outbound short. A Skagit head in the right size for a water anchored cast will be pretty heavy for overhead casting, so if that's what you are basing your line choice on, you may want to reconsider.
 

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"A Skagit head in the right size for a water anchored cast will be pretty heavy for overhead casting, so if that's what you are basing your line choice on, you may want to reconsider."

That's a valid concern. This tact does generally call for use of a lighter skagit head, one sized appropriately for overhead casting and still take advantage of it's enormous turnover capacity and ease of use. Not looking for hero / distance casts here.. a good tactic for rough weather, BIG ties, sitting atop a kayak, practical well working fishing cast. It's somewhat a specialty tactic rather than the norm.. personally, I'm also a big fan of the RIO Outbound. However it is quite viable and if that's the way the original poster wants to go about it I'll try and advise accordingly.

Keep in mind that with overhead casting total grains are the figure you go with, so includes the weight of any tip should you choose to incorporate one.
 

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This style of fishing is growing rapidly on the Atlantic coast. One of my close friends does this in the salt. Fishing a switch rod specifically with a Skagit overhead casting is getting very popular here in the northeast. My buddy uses rio or airflo density compensated "replacement tips" these tips are tapered and will give you the proper turnover for an overhead cast with Skagit. Definitely get replacement tips in Floating, Intermediate, type 3, type 6 and type 8 sink rates. This setup should work well for you. The idea is the 11ft.+ length allows you to back cast without hitting the dunes or downward sloping beach behind you, you can back cast high and clear of the sand! Also the nature of using two hands allows you to punch through stiff winds and turn over heavy gear.

If you have any other specific questions about this style of fishing I know a few people that Fish this style exclusively, even shops nearby have adopted this technique. I can ask them any questions u might have that I can't answer.
 

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I cast overhead with my skagit outfit all of the time when I'm fishing if there is room.

Tips 10 feet long from floating to sinking of various sink rates from 80 to 120 grains or more should cast good with that head. I suggest a tip. But I havent tried to overhead without a tip yet. Might work fine.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
So I ordered a 75gr 10 ft intermediate tip a few days ago, but it won't get here until monday. I had the rod, the line, and nothing to do until hockey came on later, so I thought I'd head out to the soccer field to mess around with casting this thing and see how it works. This is only backing-running line-head. No leader or fly either. I didn't want to spend half of my time out there undoing wind knots so I held off.

After an hour of not really getting it, it finally started to make sense. The process I settled on was as follows. Leave about 18 feet of the head out of the rod, back cast at a 45 degree angle, let some line shoot out (probably about 10-20 feet extra), and wing it forward. Zero false casting. By the end of the session I was consistently shooting all of the running line out down to the knot connecting the backing, so about 100-110 foot casts.

1. I need a lighter line. Even without the tip, it feels like a wet noodle trying to cast this. A lot of you thought I would need a lighter line, and you are right.

2. The head never will land straight. The head wants nothing more than to hit the ground as soon as possible, and this is resulting in either it landing at a right angle, with about 10 feet of the head going straight, and half going perpendicular of the rest of the line, or the end of the head landing early, so once again only ten feet of the head would extend, then it would turn around at the half way part run parallel back to the running line (imagine an upside down U). Bender predicted told me this would happen, we'll see how it'll work with the tip.



So I'm at a crossroad. Keep hunting for head weights and tip to work, or just try using the rio outbound. The outbound 10wt is 425gr.
 
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Tip or no tip you'll continue to get those until you add an adequate leader. Even in practice you need it. Even if it's 5' of 20# knotted to 5' of 15# you'll notice a difference. You just don't get that kick at the end of the cast.
 
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