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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have an older Sage 8 wt 12'6" rod that I want to use for beach fishing pinks and coho on Vancouver Island. I would be overhead casting, primarily. The Sage web page recommends a Skagit 550-600 line or a Scandi 480-510 line for spey casting with this rod. What line and weight would forum members suggest that I select for my Sage rod and intended use?
 

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Go see Courtney at Nile Creek fly shop and buy a snowbee switch line, lots of guys on the beach use it.....me included

Sent from my SGH-I547C using Tapatalk
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Still Confused.

Thanks Coastrider. The Snowbee web page indicates the "switch" line for a 8/9 wt rod is 450 gr. This is where it gets confusing. I also have a 6/7 12'6'' Elkhorn rod with an Airflo Scandi head 7/8/9 floating with 450 gr. which casts quite well overhead (the Rio recommended spey line). Will the same weight line cast as well overhead on a 8 wt rod as on a 6/7 wt rod?

I made a mistake in my original posting - the recommended lines are on the Rio web page.
 

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Stop by and see the boys there, this way you can test cast what ever line you choose. Im not familiar with your rod but lots of guys have the 12'6 sage one with snowbee lines. Try before you buy is the only way to go, otherwise its trial and error which gets pricey. Also if you just want an approx weight, go see Hugh at wholesale and borrow the steelhead Scandi kit to get the weight . I used that kit to dial in my 12' 6/7 for the beach and then purchased a line in that weight range. Dont forget to leave some weight for poly tips is you want to use them. Cheers

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FISHIN' FREELANCER
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Hello Wilf and welcome to the forum

The key here is spey vs overhead casting. Nothing alike, two total different methods of casting.

With spey casts, especially Skagit style, a lot of the shooting heads weight is supported by water so it takes a few more grains to load the rod correct. With overhead casting the entire weight of the shooting head is aerialised and constant. As a rule (for same rod) you'll see Skagit recommendations as heaviest grains, Scandinavian in the mid area, and overhead the lightest. Everyone has a unique style and quest for a specific rod load 'feel'.

Coastriders advice to get the head kit and establish head weight preference is solid.

If not, I'd probably start with about a 450gr head.

Best of luck
 

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When you go to the Rio web page and look at the line recommendations for your specific rod look at the extreme right of the chart under the Outbound heading. You will see a WF line suggestion from Rio from their Outbound line series once you get that you can check the grain weight of that line and it should get you in the ballpark for overhead use regardless of which brand of line you decide to purchase. The other option is to try different line grain wts and choose the range that you like. As has been stated earlier the line for overhead work is probly going to be lighter than you would use to speycast.
 

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I'm no expert with overheading a two-handed rod, but I do it a fair bit with 11'0" to 11'7" rods.

From what I've gleaned from others on this forum that have a lot more experience than me is that you need a lot less grains when going overhead, compared to spey casts. In my experience, this is true.

Basically, I've found that I can overhead cast pretty much any of my shooting heads, so long as they are at the lower end of the grain window for the rod and I'm not chucking monster pike flies. Sure there are some strong differences in the smoothness and turnover depending on the type (Scandi, Skagit) and grain weight of the head, but they all send a fly really far when going overhead.

My preference, however, is to use a specific overhead line, like a Airflo 40+ or Rio Outbound. (I haven't yet tried the new Beulah Serum, but its probably quite good).

I don't pay much attention to the labeled line class, instead focusing on the grain weight. For me, I tend to like an integrated line (e.g. Airflo 40+) with a grain weight of about 20% less than what I would use for a scandi head.

So, if I like a Scandi 510 on a 8/9 rod, then for an overhead line I'm looking for something around 410 grains (+/- 10-20 grains). For a 6/7 rod that I use a 390 scandi, I'm looking for an overhead line around 310 grains (again +/- 10-20 grains).

Of course, if you have a regular single hand line in the appropriate grain size, it would likely work just fine too. For example on a 4/5 switch rod that I use a 270 scandi head for spey casting, I like standard 8 weight lines (210 grains) for overhead casting. Works great.

The key for me is to think about an overhead line that is about 20% less than the lower end of the stated grain window for spey casting. I think Peter Charles gave me that advice, and it works for me. YMMV.

For your Sage 8 weight with a scandi grain window of 480-510, I would start with a line with head weight of 385-410 grains (focus on the lower end if you plan on adding a polyleaders [I don't use them overhead]), and see where that takes you.

And, length matters too. I like 30-35 foot long heads on the two-handed rods - nice smooth turnover.

Hope this helps.

Tom
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Thank you everyone for your input. I appears that the Rio Outbound Short #9 might be a suitable line with 375 gr. and a 30' head? I see that the regular Outbound 9 Wt is the same weight but with a 37.5' head. It appears a shorter head is preferable?

For Coho beach fishing, would a floating line or a clear intermediate sink be preferable?
 

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For most of my beach fishing I use a full floater and long leaders 99 percent of the time. If you want a little more sink you can add a sinking leader that has your desired sink rate. Usually for me it will be a 1.5-2 inch per sec sink rate. Your mileage may vary. Just remember quite often staging coho will be in relatively shallow water.
 

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I should have mentioned in my previous post that there is a chapter in the book Island Fly Fisherman that was written by Frank Dalziel that is a very good source of info for anglers that are new to the beach fishing game. The book was published by Harbour Publishing and should be available locally.
 

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I overhead and Spey cast same Scandi heads. It is easier to use wider casting stroke when OH casting so rod does not bend too much. Heavier head casts longer too.

Esa
 

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For overhead casting I tend to go up 1 line size on an airflo 40+ so a 9 wt. the fast intermediate one is wonderful
 

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Spey Is The Way
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New question

Where on the Sage web page do you find line recommendations?
 

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Spey Is The Way
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Sorry Wilf I missed that, due to being so excited that Sage might actually tell us what to use on their rods.

Funny thing, I've never been that great casting a two handed rod over head. Could not get the line to load the rod properly or I could not feel the line load the rod and just imagine if I went down a line size. I had a St. Croix switch which I could not cast over head worth ****. When I made a spey cast the rod came to life. Funny thing number two if I remember correctly, if I used one hand over head it worked for me but two hands over head, no way. I must have some type of brain interruption when using two hands to cast overhead.

So I'll just over head cast single handed rods and spey cast two handed ones.

Just my thoughts.
 

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FISHIN' FREELANCER
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Wilf, by far your best option will be to try some different heads. As Coastrider suggests, get the kit and cast a variety of weights. One or two of them will quickly point towards where you need to be.

I don't know which series Sage you have. I just acquired a Graphite IV 8124-3 and after initial spey casting session with 510gr Scan head I can't imagine using much lighter than 450gr in an overhead application. Your rod may be much different.. You have the Airflo 450 in your possession.. at least try it. Should reveal quite a little.

375gr just sounds light.

Best of luck.. B
 
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