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Discussion Starter #1
As I see two-handed rod casting, everyone is forming some kind of delta-wedge type D loop behind them with an anchor a rod and half off the casters shoulder to do their spey type cast (switch, single, double, snake etc.). This presents a big problem when I have obstacles beside, behind, directly overhead of me. In these situations, D-loops of any sort are troubling. All these casts are based on the 180 degree D-loop. Is there some way to make the cast without a large-behind-you D-loop? I can do the "Perry Poke" but it still is basically a sweep to a 180 degree loop and if somethings overhead ---ooch. I enjoy the challenge of making long cast, but I find myself in more restricted casting positions where the brush, trees, back-against-rock walls are my challange. Fish don't always lie in perfect long-cast-lies situations. I find more times they are where my casting position is highly restricted. Just cursious to see how other fishers handle these fishing situations.
 

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Junkyard Spey
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Derek Brown talks of using the "Square Cut" cast when obstacles are tight to your back. He demonstates this cast in his video "Spey Masterclass".
 

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I think this is a situation where the underhand-style of single spey with a very short head comes into its own.

There have been several excellent speycasting threads on another board recently. In one of them, two notable practitioners (Simon Gawesworth and Michael Evans), both of whom prefer mid- to long-belly lines in normal circumstances, suggested that the smaller D-loop of the underhand cast was useful, if not essential, in constricted spaces.
 

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Coast2coast Flyfishaholic
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Skagit casts! Made for this situation. You can perry poke your way through some really tight water.
 

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The skagit cast, underhand,perry poke, or contrived loop casting as faulkus would say are worth learning, as you can make casts with the brush or rocks right at your backside. there is no water that can't be covered with the spey cast, in all its forms with single or two handed rods. The perry poke cast is very effective and has become quite popular as of late, and no one does this as gracefully as Ed, its a beautiful thing to watch! But it has been around for some time, Faulkus calls it the contrived loop method and did not use shooting heads he used standard double tapers. The square cut is another handy cast to learn but is limited in its change of direction but has bailed me out of some really bad situations in heavy down stream wind. Spend some time working on these casts and I think you will find that you will be able to fish anywhere you please reguardless of whats behind you.

Brian
 

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Fish don't always lie in perfect long-cast-lies situations. I find more times they are where my casting position is highly restricted. Just cursious to see how other fishers handle these fishing situations....
I don't particularly like fishing with truly long rods so I try to get away with shorter ones as often as possible. But the one truly useful function of long rods, from my point of view, is that you can create and plant a loop that is completely in front of you or to your side. You won't get quite the same distance that way, but it's good enough for a lot iof situations.
 

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I have had some success with using the spiral roll with brush behind. What I do is instead of a single accelleration to form the "D" loop I do two accellerations. The first is the forward stoke after the lift, this accelleration actually throws the loop out into the river then you come back and fire ( all one movement) but instead of the loon being behind you it's along side you.
Another way to look at it would be instead of making a circle downstream of you make an elongated Oval down and out from you.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Still Wondering/Wandering

If we load the rod by making a D-loop w/small anchor to throw a long line (what we love to see at the spey clave), can we also load the rod by using water tenison with the shorter head and keep the rod loading by making a compact circular motion. In other words, a radius motion around to the KICK using the water tension as the anchor not the aerolize D-loop and sweet kiss of water-touch-down. Then the back D-loop can be smaller, in front, out to the side or most anywhere. Maybe what I'm getting at: Is there some other strokes other than the "long stroke" to get a quality cast.
Thanks for everyones input. I've really enjoy listening to seasoned casters opinion and suggestions. This Two-Handed Rod business is an addiction--like I'm telling ya'll something new.
 

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addiction;not trying to cure it are ya'

what line, leader, fly, rod,are ya' `chuckin',,i'm sure i do casts that are unnamed,of course i might name them as i'm doing them !,every setting is dif.,as well as afformentioned setup,,???:D
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Back to ya Hammer

Three rods-- Saga 12'6" for a 7 wt. 46' [email protected] grains of weight and leader lenghts vary to condition, 15' 9wt. Burkie w/650grains. Orvis SL 14' for 9wt. Lines are Hybrids (both sink tip and floaters). I make them to get the right grains for each rod. My question back to you is--Are you keeping the rod loaded at all times and making some kind of radius (circular) move so there is never a 90 degree move of the rod. Love to see what you are going. Klem
 

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bring yer' binoculars

you might not want to watch me swingin'!!remember, i'm an oregone',,can't read wright,spellrite,,and having no proper teachings in the matter,i'm writing my own book,,but i will say that an overlined rod will ruin the trip for me,as a matter of fact i carry;a bottle of lacquer,and a tying bobbin,with monocord,to splice lines if i have to,,plus my main theme is to slice the water up,like drift fishing;getting bigger arches,starting close ,,searching for biters,adjusting for depth with whatever it takes,splitshot,leadcore,even take the leader between knots pinch a loop,between thumb and forfinger,,run it thru the eye of a sinker,,`otis bug',thenover the body,so ,as you see,the `grain' wt's change,plus where the weight IS ,i focus on the TAG,if the bug`s',land `right',or are at the `right' area,,,in the film,,,,then drive it out there,someone posted about fishing dif. line for an hour each,,shouldn't take more than 5 casts to figure if the rods folding over your nuckles or not bending enough to load,and that's while fishing,,,underline you rod then add from there,how else are you going to know,i feel there's a sweet spot combo of line /rod,but,add some leadcore ,weighted patterns,max distance cast=overload,slow down the stroke, then groan to yourself,not as sweet as,,,,,,,,,,well,, haveta' save it ,said i was writing a book!!!,,remember,run what ya' brung ,i do this FOR FUN :hehe:
 

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spey pages videos

have you downloaded some of the vid.s on the spey pages,i believe it' D Brown's reverse double backslappin',sidesteppin,horeshoe,barrelroll,snake flippin,,cast that,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,watch his rod tip,,watch how much his rod loads,he has COMMAND,that's what it takes,COMMAND,,bye!
 

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Junkyard Spey
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Special Cast

I have a special cast that I use alot when my back is tight to bankside brush or other obstructions. I call it the %#&?!!#$X&%! cast. :hehe:
 

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thank the gods they're behind me,don't look back!

i had one one night i laughed and called it a claw hammer,took one sweep out to the side then a sorta snakey roll drive,,but i wasn't fishing that far out as the steelhead were crowding me!!!!probably a name for it,although not printable,,,,fun'l work tho'!
 

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JD
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Almost makes you wish

you had a spinning rod....Almost.:devil:
 

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Discussion Starter #17
converting back to spinning rod

AND if you compressed a shooting head down to say 3" or 4" inches you'd end up with a "slinky"---then overhead and back brush would not be a problem. Klem
 

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in an old mag . from the library that one of my girls,got me,someone had at one time developed a short ,very short,`head',floating,specifically,to be marketed as such,for spinning rods,,,,i think it went to Scandanavia ,,heck get a DaiwaWS1302HS,and,let'er' FLY:D
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Right On, friend. I remember those -- they worked pretty good too.
 

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The Square Cut works for what you are trying to do. Something else to try is tipping your rod out so you keep the line off to the side out and away from the obstructions. Again with the rod out to the side, short line, quick load, and fire the cast.
Good luck,
Leroy.......................
 
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