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CF Burkheimer, Olson, Teno, Danielsson, Guideline, Rio, Nextcast.
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
U.S. citizens and residents who’ve had a full course of Covid-19 vaccines could be allowed in for non-essential travel as early as mid-August, according to a summary of a meeting with provincial leaders provided by the prime minister’s office late Thursday. The government is expected to share more details on these plans early next week.


Canada will be able to welcome fully vaccinated travelers from all countries by early September if “the current positive path of vaccination rate and public health conditions continue,” Justin Trudeau said.
 

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Broken Down Spey Freak
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Yes JT is an idiot but if the trend continues of lower and lower infection rates there is no reason not to. However, there are still many communities on the rise or still in lock down. As long as this exist somewhere I think it's a bad idea to open the border.
 

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One more cast...
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I figured the delta variant would give the powers that be enough pause to keep the border closed for the next couple months at least. Guess my figuring was wrong.
 

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Spey Is The Way
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Don't count out your figuring yet. Let's see what Lambda does to the situation.

Leo
 

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CF Burkheimer, Olson, Teno, Danielsson, Guideline, Rio, Nextcast.
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Discussion Starter · #6 · (Edited)
Yes JT is an idiot but if the trend continues of lower and lower infection rates there is no reason not to. However, there are still many communities on the rise or still in lock down. As long as this exist somewhere I think it's a bad idea to open the border.
How is a fully vaccinated American a greater danger to Canadians then a fully vaccinated Canadian?
How is a fully vaccinated Canadian a greater danger to Americans then a fully vaccinated American?


Right now it is easier for Canadians to fly to Paris or Florida and come back, then crossing bridge over Niagara Falls
If fully vaccinated people should not cross the border to Canada, then border should be sealed both way.

The infection is predominantly among unvaccinated people, and among fully vaccinated is very low ( like 3 per 100). Those fully vaccinated are either asymptomatic or have flue like symptom. Transmission rate of fully vaccinated and infected person is 5-7 time lower.

The reality is that Covid will be with us like influenza forever ( flu virus also belong to coronavirus family) and people should get vaccinated and use to live with it.

Should the border be closed during every flue season ??

Of course if the situation gets very bad who knows what will happen.

P.S.

My intention was to inform people only, so please do not make political comments or try to suggest that the same vaccine is more effective north of the border.........
 

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How is a fully vaccinated American a greater danger to Canadians then a fully vaccinated Canadian?
How is a fully vaccinated Canadian a greater danger to Americans then a fully vaccinated American?


Right now it is easier for Canadians to fly to Paris or Florida and come back, then crossing bridge over Niagara Falls
If fully vaccinated people should not cross the border to Canada, then border should be sealed both way.

The infection is predominantly among unvaccinated people, and among fully vaccinated is very low ( like 3 per 100). Those fully vaccinated are either asymptomatic or have flue like symptom. Transmission rate of fully vaccinated and infected person is 5-7 time lower.

The reality is that Covid will be with us like influenza forever ( flu virus also belong to coronavirus family) and people should get vaccinated and use to live with it.

Should the border be closed during every flue season ??

Of course if the situation gets very bad who knows what will happen.

P.S.

My intention was to inform people only, so please do not make political comments or try to suggest that the same vaccine is more effective north of the border.........
I don't understand the situation on the land crossings. I know of several people that have left Canada to head south and returned to a 14 day isolation. Also, I live close to the border(within an hour) and I sure see a lot of American license plates. Not just commercial traffic. SUV's and mini vans full of families, some towing RV's and such. I'm not sure if there is an actual closure on the crossings at this point.
 

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CF Burkheimer, Olson, Teno, Danielsson, Guideline, Rio, Nextcast.
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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I don't understand the situation on the land crossings. I know of several people that have left Canada to head south and returned to a 14 day isolation. Also, I live close to the border(within an hour) and I sure see a lot of American license plates. Not just commercial traffic. SUV's and mini vans full of families, some towing RV's and such. I'm not sure if there is an actual closure on the crossings at this point.
Some people are exempt. All essential travelers, commercial trackers etc are also exempt.

If case you did not know .
Since July 5th, fully vaccinated Canadian citizen/permanent resident can arrive to Canada with no need for isolation.
 

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So it is mid-August or "early September" as indicated in the Trudeau quote? This matters to me as my departure date is August 18, and that is only if I can obtain my fishing permits via snail mail (the only way this permit is issued) prior to departure. Talk about cutting it close!
 

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So it is mid-August or "early September" as indicated in the Trudeau quote? This matters to me as my departure date is August 18, and that is only if I can obtain my fishing permits via snail mail (the only way this permit is issued) prior to departure. Talk about cutting it close!
Mid August for us Canada border sept for the rest of the world
 

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So it is mid-August or "early September" as indicated in the Trudeau quote? This matters to me as my departure date is August 18, and that is only if I can obtain my fishing permits via snail mail (the only way this permit is issued) prior to departure. Talk about cutting it close!
I'm sure something can be arranged via your Canadian destination address (?)
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I'm sure something can be arranged via your Canadian destination address (?)
"First Ministers also discussed how to continue safely adjusting border measures. The Prime Minister noted that, if our current positive path of vaccination rate and public health conditions continue, Canada would be in a position to welcome fully vaccinated travellers from all countries by early September.

He noted the ongoing discussions with the United States on reopening plans, and indicated that we could expect to start allowing fully vaccinated U.S. citizens and permanent residents into Canada as of mid-August for non-essential travel."

See link to official to the notes from the PMs meeting in my original post.

The statement is crystal clear.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
I think you folks south of the border will have another surprise, all unvaccinated fish seem to have been restricted from entering the skeena river for a few years. And those that have entered must be wearing masks because they sure ain't biting!

You are probably right. I have looked back at Tyee old data I have back to 1990, for years where there were not commercial fishery or very light from July 10 time frame and when water discharge at Usk was overall favorable: 2200 m3/sec or less. And so far 2021 is shaping as possible worst then 2019 or 2020 . In 2019 from the last week of August to 3rd week fo September fishing for Steelhead in mid-section of the Skeena was OK ( assuming one has jet boat to move around) mainly due to outstanding water clarity in 80-120 cm !!!!! and temperature 12-15 C.

At this point fish should be coming consistently, even if Tyee unit representing catch per hour are small, like 0.2-0.7 or so. Such patter means a very weak run.

Clearly back in 2016-2018 food supply near the coast of BC was poor for juvenile salmon/Steelhead. The biggest impact on returns is juvenile salmon/Steelhead survival in the first 6-8 months in Pacific near the coast until they reach 25-30 cm/ 10-12 inches . Then they can travel to The Gulf of Alaska and further west as Steelhead constantly does.

"
Northern strains of copepods typically dominate the Washington/Oregon coastal zooplankton community during the summer ( also BC) . These northern copepods tend to be larger and fat-rich providing smaller fish important calories needed to grow and survive through winter. Southern strains of copepods are smaller and have less fat in them essentially providing fish a “low calorie” diet. Data shows that when northern copepods are abundant, survival of salmon and steelhead goes up, whereas when southern copepods are abundant, survival goes down.

The figure below shows how the biomass of northern and southern copepods have fluctuated in comparison to average since 1997. What is very apparent is that in all of 2016, northern copepod biomass was down and southern copepods abundance was up. This doesn’t bode well for salmon and steelhead survival."

382996




It takes fish 10-12 days to pass commercial fishery areas ( currently closed) within 10 km form the estuary to enter Skeena. Either there are very few fish there, or for some reason they are reluctant to come or not there yet.

Are you aware of any check point set up by the BC government which requires Steelhead to stay near estuary for 14 days self-isolation.......Maybe they still wait for covid test ??
 

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One more cast...
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I think you folks south of the border will have another surprise, all unvaccinated fish seem to have been restricted from entering the skeena river for a few years. And those that have entered must be wearing masks because they sure ain't biting!
This is awesome and made me laugh.
 

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This discussion topic needs it's own vaccine. It's now on its Delta variant and could continue tu mutate...

And just for yhe record, JT is an idiot is redundant... All politicians are idiots... Job requirement...
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 · (Edited)
Vaccinated people either in the US or Canada have no influence on the future trajectory of the virus. Right now even Canada is approaching a plateau with single vaccinated people 70% total or 80% 12+ old ( eligible) . Even experts in Canada expect max 75% total fully vaccinated or 80-85% eligible.
It is 15% of eligible 12+ years old who refuse to get shot who will dictate the trajectory of the next 6 months. It will never end, unless 95% takes a shot or you get herd immunity.
Among Fully vaccinated when infected a big majority having a mild symptoms, cold like, and will get even more resistant to the future mutants. So far 99% people going to hospital are those who are unvaccinated, 99.5 percent of the deaths right now in the U.S. are individuals who are not inoculated.
Unfortunately a big majority of Anti-vaxxes do not want free of charge Wi-Fi chip, because they are influenced by cynical politicians and their allies ( who already took vaccine.....) to gain power.
 

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One more cast...
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Vaccinated people either in the US or Canada have no influence on the future trajectory of the virus. Right now even Canada is approaching a plateau with single vaccinated people 70% total or 80% 12+ old ( eligible) . Even experts in Canada expect max 75% total fully vaccinated or 80-85% eligible.
It is 15% of eligible 12+ years old who refuse to get shot who will dictate the trajectory of the next 6 months. It will never end, unless 95% takes a shot or you get herd immunity.
Among Fully vaccinated when infected a big majority having a mild symptoms, cold like, and will get even more resistant to the future mutants. So far 99% people going to hospital are those who are unvaccinated, 99.5 percent of the deaths right now in the U.S. are individuals who are not inoculated.
Unfortunately a big majority of Anti-vaxxes do not want free of charge Wi-Fi chip, because they are influenced by cynical politicians and their allies ( who already took vaccine.....) to gain power.
I agree with most of what you are saying.

I don’t agree that “vaccinated people…have no influence on the future trajectory of the virus”. This is too broad of a statement because we don’t know what the future holds regarding variants. Data already shows that vaccinated people can spread the delta variant, even if it’s a low level. Thus, vaccinated people still need to be vigilant about wearing masks in high risk areas/situations, as they can contribute to spread.

I also don’t agree with “Fully vaccinated when infected…will get even more resistant to the future mutants.” I wish that were the case, but it is not necessarily true. Unfortunately we may see mutants that are mostly or completely resistant to the effects of our vaccines. That’s why it’s so important that everyone gets vaccinated to stop this ongoing pandemic before we get more mutants circulating. Of course we will fall short of that goal, so it’s ironic that the anti-vaxxers who want personal freedom and independence are the very ones keeping us all in this cycle of restrictions.

But again, I agree with most of what you are saying, so I’m not trying to disagree with your overall message.
 
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