[Jason]

So I have a bit of a situation that I've been debating how best to handle, and I thought that some of you may have some good insight or suggestions. So the short version is that my father in law has asked to purchase 10 of my "more artistic" flies, intending to frame a couple and use a couple as gifts. While I'm obviously happy that he enjoys them to that level, it does put me in a bit of a thorny spot as far as "selling" them to him. He has asked for a quote, knowing just how wildly expensive some classic flies can be (from more experienced, and well known tiers of course).

Part of me feels that I can't really see charging him any substantial sum of money, and I really would prefer to simply give him some of my flies. On the other hand 10 flies of that type is a fair bit of time, materials, and certainly effort on my part. Money is always tight, and I sometimes cringe at just how much $$$ I spend on this crazy hobby. For every 1 good one that I would feel could merit making the cut, there would likely be 5-10 flies that just weren't quite up to standard... for any myriad of reasons. Which makes me more inclined to charge something for the flies. Just having a hard time coming up with a cash amount that would feel right.

Options would range from simply covering the costs of some of the more pricey materials, to putting a price that reflects, to some degree at least, the level of pride that I feel in the flies. I think that I've posted enough of some of my better flies that many of you have an idea of what I am capable of producing; which is to say, while far from the level of some of the more respected tiers here I do feel that I create a few which have some real heart and soul in them and every now and then something special comes off the vise.

I thought I might post my sentiments here, in part, because I would imagine that many of you may have already faced similar situations. I also have tremendous respect for the artistic talents, technical skills, knowledge, and experience level of so many of you here. I would value your thoughts and/or personal experiences ...
Thanks,
JB

 

[Back Eddy]

Happy Wife

Happy Husband a no brainer to me

When she is telling you how wonderful and thpughtful you are hit her up for that dream trip or new piece of kit

 

[borderfly]

I would look at this as family and charge for the materials and labor for what you are doing. He seems like a bright man and knows what it takes to make one of these beautiful creations and knows that they are not free.

Charge what you put into the project and no more, just cover your time and material. Sit down and write out which each fly consists of material wise then add your time in at a reasonable rate.

He knows the value of time and material and charging him any less would be an insult.

My 2 cents your bill is in the mail.:chuckle:

KC

 

[Jason]

Good stuff guys.
Back Eddy, could not agree more with the happy wife=happy husband philosophy on life. Live that way every day, and it has kept my marriage intact for a dozen years already. Not sure how I ever snared her in the first place, but I'm keeping her. Lucky, in this case she's pretty happy just that her dad wants some of my flies. She ties a bit too, and has seen the sweat on my brow, the trembling hands, heard the "oh no, NO, NOOOOOO!" more than a few times... she gets it completely.

KC, thanks, and "the check's in the mail" $.02 it is
JB

 

[theCC]

Sorry to trample on any one's conception of spinning fluff...however, it's not (A)rt...though certainly artisanal...

Never do business with family man, quite simply, enough to be asked and that they would consider your flies frame-worthy. What's a few flies between family??? You're the tier...tie more...and likely better ones with repetition.

They're only tools J...

Cheers

 

[Marty]

Pick a financial need of comparable value of which both you and your wife have. Tell your father-in-law you don’t want to charge him for the flies but my wife and I could really use a (whatever the need is). Your father-in-law will think what a selfless and gallant son-in-law I have and your wife will love you more than ever. Win-win.

 

[Bob Budesa]

Really?

I'm with Back Eddy, Chase, and Marty.

Happy Wife = Happy Life.

Plus it's just a good thing to do.

Have him buy a good bottle of single malt that you two can share when you give him the critters. I think you'll always wonder whether or not you should have taken the money, but if you gift them to him, you'll never regret it. And how much are we really talking about? Peanuts in the long run.

sláinte mhaith

 

[Tyke]

You could mention that a [bottle of] Lagavulin always assists with the creative thought process.........

Regards, Tyke.

 

[Tyke]

I'm with Back Eddy, Chase, and Marty.

Happy Wife = Happy Life.

Plus it's just a good thing to do.

Have him buy a good bottle of single malt that you two can share when you give him the critters.

sláinte mhaith

Wow - identical thought process in operation as I was typing!

Tyke.

 

[middlecalf]

I've given my father-in-law (and mother-in-law, together) several framed and matted photographs that I've produced (I do everything except make the paper - I do my own sensitizing expect for color - from capture to printing - analog in a darkroom - to mounting, matting and framing). I figure without considering the artistic side I've invested about $200 per picture. Given where I'm at with my photography (or more accurately where I'm not), I could probably get $300-$500 for one of my prints, framed, etc. I had one (donated) sell at an auction for $400.
In return, I've received a lot of things from him (& her), a lot that doesn't even include any "thing."
Just give it to him with a smile and gratitude that he sees and appreciates your talent. You can sell to a lot of other people if needed.

 

[MZilliox]

I'd have him make an investment into hooks and materials for you. You can tie him flies, I'm sure you have the hooks and materials, and as payment, he can help replenish the supply, maybe a few packls of hooks, a turkey tail, peacock, that sort of thing.

 

[Jason]

I like the trade idea, especially a good single malt! I like that
Just one thing that I should clarify on the "happy wife" side of things; she's more in favor of some form of compensation that I am truth be told. Though I think she'll be happy either way. She's glad that her father wants to display, and to gift some of her husbands flies, and that's about it I think.

Thanks for the feedback guys, do appreciate it
JB

 

[Jason]

I've given my father-in-law (and mother-in-law, together) several framed and matted photographs that I've produced (I do everything except make the paper - I do my own sensitizing expect for color - from capture to printing - analog in a darkroom - to mounting, matting and framing). I figure without considering the artistic side I've invested about $200 per picture. Given where I'm at with my photography (or more accurately where I'm not), I could probably get $300-$500 for one of my prints, framed, etc. I had one (donated) sell at an auction for $400.
In return, I've received a lot of things from him (& her), a lot that doesn't even include any "thing."
Just give it to him with a smile and gratitude that he sees and appreciates your talent. You can sell to a lot of other people if needed.

I have done this as well, and I have given him one of my nicer flies tied to date (have given plenty of others away to lots of others as well of course, some nice some purely functional). Which is really more the way I would prefer to do things. That fly that I gifted him may well have been the spark of his idea to "place an order" for 10. I think that's the part that changes things a little for me. It would be much much simpler if it were just a gift here and there if/when I came up with something that I felt like sharing.

 

[Back Eddy]

Based on below Leave all Negotions up to her

Sounds like a possible set up lose lose


:Eyecrazy:

I like the trade idea, especially a good single malt! I like that
Just one thing that I should clarify on the "happy wife" side of things; she's more in favor of some form of compensation that I am truth be told. Though I think she'll be happy either way. She's glad that her father wants to display, and to gift some of her husbands flies, and that's about it I think.

Thanks for the feedback guys, do appreciate it
JB

 

[gt05254]

Personally, I'd just give him the flies. Maybe something cool will come from him in return, if he's any kind of a guy. If not, well, you've learned something about him.
I'm charging 3 cents for my opinions today. sorry.
Gary

 

[failtospey]

Personally, I'd just give him the flies. Maybe something cool will come from him in return, if he's any kind of a guy. If not, well, you've learned something about him.
I'm charging 3 cents for my opinions today. sorry.
Gary

This is the best thing to do, by far. I never charged anyone for flies, although mine may not be a schmookler I do ok, I mostly look at it as I am forever etched in someone else's life in some form or another, weather hanging on their wall or swinging into the lips of fish. I had a guy ask me to tie him up a few dozen trout flies for money, I said no charge. He layer offered to buy me tying tools and I said hell to the yeah!

 

[Bwana Bill]

Go for the Scotch!! :hihi:

More importantly, go with your gut feeling! You, more than anyone, know who you are dealing with.

Myself, having freely given away flies, hooks, and other materials, I would just make a gift of it!

While we all know that a lot of time, effort, and soul go into our creations, they are after all, just "Hooks, Feathers, and Floss".

I hope all goes well- you'll make the right decision!!

-Bill

 

[Cutthroat1954]

I've tied for $$, donated to auctions, and gifted flies. I think the most satisfaction I receive is when I give my flies away; especially to family or to folks having tough days out fishing. Money is just money; nice to have, but not something you will remember as you age. The wonderful thing about giving flies (to me) is that I have control over the creative process. And I must admit that it is hard to put a value on smiles, new friends, and looks of gratitude when I am able to watch someone catch a fish on my flies, or really appreciate them. Those things you will always remember.

The talent I see displayed every day on this site is hard to describe; simply stated, beyond fantastic!

You are indeed very lucky to have a wife who shares your passion and appreciates the amount of work that goes into your flies. I would give them to your father-in-law with the understanding that they will come as you are able to make them. That way, there is no pressure on you. One or two at a time. Very nice to have family that thinks enough of your work to offer to purchase it. But exchange of dollars will (to some extent) turn the project into a job. I have a hunch that returns from gifting will be far better than dollars and cents.

 

[Honyuk96]

I give away lots of flies and materials to peeps I've never even met. Family.... Fork it over, you'll be glad you did.

 

[Jason]

More thanks guys. I think that most of you have been more or less getting at what my gut response was too: that I am not in this to make any money, and that I don't feel quite right selling flies to my father in law. If my posts didn't convey it, let me be clear that I am in complete agreement with all of you about giving flies freely.
There is no dilemma whatsoever on tying some flies as a gift for him and others, but I don't think this is what he is looking for. I think KC raised a very good point, and that's the bit that has been the trickiest for me to sort. While I don't think he would exactly be "insulted" if I were to refuse any money for the flies, a big part of this is clearly his attempt to be supportive of my hobby, and encourage further development. He may also be in part looking to do something nice for the box of trout flies, and the 3wt trout rod I just built him for his birthday just recently (which came out great if I do say so myself!).

I do think he'd feel bad if it seemed in any way that his kind and generous notion were turned around into something of an obligation or a burden (real or perceived). Given that I know he's expecting to pay probably far more than I would ever feel comfortable accepting I do think that it would be best for me to accept something. I do like the scotch idea, though honestly I'm more inclined to simply quote him something just to cover the costs of my materials (or even perhaps just some new materials). Certainly much less than what he had in mind, and probably less than a good bottle of scotch!
JB