casting really big flies - Spey Pages
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post #1 of 20 (permalink) Old 03-03-2013, 04:04 PM Thread Starter
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casting really big flies

Hey guys

Just curious about the limitations of the set up. I was fishing my beulah platinum switch 6 wt with a skagit 350 and 15 feet of type 6. I can launch flies like size 4 or 6 muddlers but surprise surprise, when strapped on a weighted 6 inch double bunny it all falls apart.
What can you do in this situation to turn over those big flies?
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post #2 of 20 (permalink) Old 03-03-2013, 10:51 PM
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For starters maybe try a heavier head, or the same weight skagit short or skagit switch head (more grains per foot), shorten the tip, try a different length leader or heavier pound test.

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post #3 of 20 (permalink) Old 03-04-2013, 01:18 AM
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What poppy said, a switch Skagit or Skagit short with more grains. A 15' sinking tip is to much to ask of a 350 gr. Skagit line. Cut the tip back to 10' & see where that gets you, a 6" bunny leach is a very heavy fly. Fly size and weight are the least discussed variables in talking about a well balanced set up. - Lawrence

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post #4 of 20 (permalink) Old 03-04-2013, 02:28 AM
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Bunny leaches are tough. 6" "double" bunnies and weighted? Sounds unmanagable with most speys under 10wt and 15'...not sure that's even enough. The leather sucks up alot of water and they get heavier the more bunny "leather" involved. Try something big but sparse with feathers instead of bunny.

Last edited by klickrolf; 03-05-2013 at 11:44 PM.
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post #5 of 20 (permalink) Old 03-04-2013, 10:23 AM
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Like it or not the size of the fish is not the only consideration when choosing a rod regardless of the type of head used. a 6 inch bunny leech and the head needed to turn it over is better suited to a 7 or 8 weight. given your location I assume you are trout fishing...

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post #6 of 20 (permalink) Old 03-04-2013, 11:29 AM Thread Starter
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Yeah, I was thinking about cutting the tip back but wanted to hear it from others before I got the nippers out. Having that tip that long, mind you, has been pretty good practice. Pretty much zero forgiveness, especially on a switch rod. Noticed a great improvement with my big stick this fall after a summer swinging the little guy.

Thanks guys
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post #7 of 20 (permalink) Old 03-04-2013, 11:37 AM
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I two hand Trout a lot with one lighter 5wt switches.

A " 6" wt'ed double bunny " is really pushing it. Try tying a less water absorbing 6" fly and lighter wt. Remove the 15' type 6 tip and replace it with 10' of T8. Use a strong leader of 15# test to 12# test Ultra Green. For fur'y, mobile hair, wt'ed tubes , etc. I think you will find about 3 1/2" - 4" x 10 grains just fine with the above and a 360.

There should not be such a gap all the way down to "sz 4 & 6 muddlers" which are very easy to cast, even with Scandi heads let alone Skagit.
The sink tip change will help you a lot. Likely, as well fishing it, casting will improve and you will get better at it. The short, light two handers like that Plat. 6 switch require a bit more accurate anchor placements and technique than longer rods with spey shooting heads. They don't have the ability to dig out junk which is not set up ideally from the start........but, they sure are light and sporty
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post #8 of 20 (permalink) Old 03-04-2013, 11:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bron View Post
Hey guys

Just curious about the limitations of the set up. I was fishing my beulah platinum switch 6 wt with a skagit 350 and 15 feet of type 6. I can launch flies like size 4 or 6 muddlers but surprise surprise, when strapped on a weighted 6 inch double bunny it all falls apart.
What can you do in this situation to turn over those big flies?
Replace the 'bunny' (a known water holding device!! ) with the 'impression' of bulk.....

have a look here ...

http://speypages.com/speyclave/showthread.php?t=66319

make 'em up to any length you need!!




Mike

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post #9 of 20 (permalink) Old 03-05-2013, 01:00 AM
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a good general rule of thumb is that sink tip length shouldn't exceed rod length. If you decide you want to cast a massive bunny anyway try a perry poke, even with the light rod it might get it out there.
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post #10 of 20 (permalink) Old 03-05-2013, 09:39 AM
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speed up the cast

Speed up yer stroke g... Drift up and out on the shot, releaseing line stick and clearing the fly. You want the fly on the surface as you cast foreward.... Stop hard with the bottem hand, this will create power to rip the fly out of the water-

but yup, you probably need more grains



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post #11 of 20 (permalink) Old 03-05-2013, 09:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Speyducer View Post
Replace the 'bunny' (a known water holding device!! ) with the 'impression' of bulk.....

have a look here ...

http://speypages.com/speyclave/showthread.php?t=66319

make 'em up to any length you need!!




Mike
Many thanks for posting up the above link Mike. Missed the first pass at that; bookmarked now. FABULOUS STUFF.

fae




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post #12 of 20 (permalink) Old 03-05-2013, 10:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bron View Post
Hey guys

Just curious about the limitations of the set up. I was fishing my beulah platinum switch 6 wt with a skagit 350 and 15 feet of type 6. I can launch flies like size 4 or 6 muddlers but surprise surprise, when strapped on a weighted 6 inch double bunny it all falls apart.
What can you do in this situation to turn over those big flies?
That is one lovely little stick. Try the shortest fattest skagit head - even if you have to chop it down to 17' long. Try heavier, shorter T tips. Nevertheless, I would rather take a beating than cast 6 inch double bunnies. I'm sure after this post I will get a few offers

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Last edited by SkagitMiester; 03-06-2013 at 09:44 AM.
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post #13 of 20 (permalink) Old 03-05-2013, 11:06 AM
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I think the best solution for your set up is to change the materials in your fly. Try making a fly with the synthetic hair that the salt water guys use. You can make a big fly that holds no water and casts really nice. Make one too look just like your favorite double bunny. Bunny is a great material but it's soooo heavy when wet.
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post #14 of 20 (permalink) Old 03-05-2013, 05:49 PM
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A 6" leach for Trout ???

After a solid 70 + weeks spend so far in Alaskan bush fishing for an aggressive Alaskan Bows, many!!!! in 24-29" range and fat, it would be really hard for me to make a statement that I can catch more and bigger fish using 5-6" fly vs. 2.5, 3" maximum. It has been a long time since I fished for a either Rainbow or Steelhead with a then 3" or shorter flies.

I fish 350-360 aggressive taper Scandi line on CFB 5115-4 with 3" or less flies, and even when water gets murky after rain, 3" fly is plenty. In Colorado or Wyoming much smaller flies works very well.
Often a 2" fly and SH wt.6 rods are more then enough.

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post #15 of 20 (permalink) Old 03-05-2013, 09:45 PM
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Originally Posted by fishmhard View Post
Stop hard with the bottem hand, this will create power to rip the fly out of the water-
the positive stop Robert just described is spot on. block your energy from escaping from drifting out that is particular important when casting big flies. If you read Al Buhr's book. He describe this as "positive stop" very important, but easily to get overlooked. "Jim Green often referred to this as a brief moment of time when the caster becomes "stone solid""

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