Swinging to the bank or below me - Spey Pages
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  • 3 Post By Marty
  • 4 Post By YORKIE
  • 3 Post By SLSS
  • 3 Post By fisshman26
  • 3 Post By Rick J
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  • 2 Post By speyday
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post #1 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-24-2018, 12:38 AM Thread Starter
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Swinging to the bank or below me

Hope I'm in the right place to pose this question. Sorry if not. There is a run that I have fished a couple of times with a very slight bend, the outside of the bend being the opposite side of the river. I am trying to figure out what would be the best sinktip configuration to get the swing all the way in to below me.

Opposite bank depth probably around 4 to 7ft depending on water level and below me on the near side around 2.5ft. Would a longer lighter tip with a weighted fly or a shorter denser tip with an unweighted be the best option.

I can get a nice slow swing but as it hits mid river it just dies. Doesn't hang up just loses momentum.

Thanks

Eoin
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post #2 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-24-2018, 03:20 AM
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It would be very hard to say, because there are so many variables. Casting distance, current spend, and type of fly would impact the depth of the presentation. I carry three sink tips in the front pocket of my waders. With the three different sink rate I can get the fly to any depth I want. I use the tips, not casting angle to gain depth. I try to swing the fly as consistently as possible. I am old school and use type 3 and type 6 tips in 12 to 15 foot lengths. I do have some heavier tips when the rivers are blown. Tips are the cheapest part of your system, They come in sets or singles, buy a couple and give them a go. Not sure where you are fishing but 12 feet of type 6 is my go-to for everywhere. If you are 2.5 feet at the hand down anything two much heavier will be dragging bottom. Good luck.
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post #3 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-24-2018, 08:08 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks for the reply I should have stated I do have a variety of tips which I will indeed try to see which will get the best swing. It's more of a theory question in so much as a short dense tip would have a steeper sink angle where the longer lighter tip would stay down longer but would be lighter. If I'm understanding correctly.

Thanks
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post #4 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-24-2018, 10:27 AM
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Simple way is to fish the run through twice!(or maybe even more times!).Firstly look to fish the inside line, don't wade, shallow angle, slow tip, light flee and fish right into the bankside.
2nd run,get in the water, heavier tip and flee and look to fish the far side through to the middle, you can always handline on your 1/2 of the river, keep your flee moving and off the bottom, you never know, something might chase and nail it!.
Of course all this is on the assumption that fish are spread across the river bank to bank, it could just be the fish prefer one side or another due to current, temperature or the height of the river.
Unless you try it all out you'll never know!,but once you do know, you can conserve your energy and target the areas of the river that are productive.
Tight lines,Yorkie.
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post #5 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-24-2018, 11:13 AM
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I've been fishing longer tips the past few years- 15 ft, DC. From the sounds of it I'd try a medium- six or seven and a medium weight fly, get a good straight cast at the right angle, and no mend. It sounds as if you want some downstream belly to develop in your swing to give you the small amount of speed to finish to the bank below.
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post #6 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-24-2018, 11:47 AM
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I agree with SLSS in that it sounds like you want a bit of a downstream belly for the inside slower water. Usually, you will get more from thinking through the casting/mending combinations to get the right depth and swing speed. Along those same lines, your casting position can sometimes make all the difference in the world; so thatís worth playing around with too. Some current configurations will not be particularly conducive for optimal swinging, and in those scenarios it is probably best to decide which water you are specifically targeting and bias your tackle and presentations accordingly. Breaking the run apart and fishing it more than once is another good suggestion, and for a novice this would have lots of benefits in terms of learning how best to present to multiple types of water one piece at a time.
Good luck, and keep at it.
JB
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post #7 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-24-2018, 10:19 PM
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To make the end of your line move in shore in most conditions including what you describe, simply at the end of the natural swing with the current.... and the line stops..... slowly move your rod tip (ie. no jerky movements) out towards the centre of the river.
This works with full floaters and sink tips
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Last edited by fisshman26; 02-24-2018 at 10:49 PM.
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post #8 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-25-2018, 01:03 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks for the replies I will be sure to give all suggestions a try. Definitely need to work on my swing management so it's great to get the advice.

Thanks again

Eoin
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post #9 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-25-2018, 01:25 PM
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Embrace the big downstream mend.
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post #10 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-25-2018, 03:01 PM
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great ideas. Think Yorkie hit on something - likely no set up will effectively fish fast 4 to 6 feet deep water and soft 2.5' deep water.
One other consideration is water conditions at time you are fishing. Typically if water is high and blown and off color I would be targeting the soft inside edge. If water clear and dropping or low, I would target the deeper portions of the run, So perhaps opposite what one might think - go light under high water and heavy under low water
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post #11 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-25-2018, 06:31 PM
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In my experience, what RickJ said is exactly right. On my waters, particularly in higher flows, the fish hug the bank where there are slower currents. This means a heavy sink tip doesn't get you to where the fish are. I actually find myself in lower flows fishing a heavier tip because the fish are going to be out in the deeper part of the run where your fly has to be in the zone earlier in the swing. When I see a guy like Rick in heavy water fishing a lighter tip, I will sit on the bank and give him the run. Because he earned it by fishing the right way!

Marty is also right about a single tip doing most of the work. You would be amazed at how versatile a single tip can be when you learn how to fish it properly. I am thinking of things like casting further upstream versus further downstream, mend versus no mend, stepping down after the cast but before the swing or not, longer leader versus shorter leader, heavy fly versus lighter fly, the angle and height of your rod tip during the swing…All of these things create meaningful variables without having to change your tip.
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Last edited by Read1t48; 02-26-2018 at 03:02 PM. Reason: typo
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post #12 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-27-2018, 05:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Read1t48 View Post
In my experience, what RickJ said is exactly right. On my waters, particularly in higher flows, the fish hug the bank where there are slower currents. This means a heavy sink tip doesn't get you to where the fish are. I actually find myself in lower flows fishing a heavier tip because the fish are going to be out in the deeper part of the run where your fly has to be in the zone earlier in the swing. When I see a guy like Rick in heavy water fishing a lighter tip, I will sit on the bank and give him the run. Because he earned it by fishing the right way!

Marty is also right about a single tip doing most of the work. You would be amazed at how versatile a single tip can be when you learn how to fish it properly. I am thinking of things like casting further upstream versus further downstream, mend versus no mend, stepping down after the cast but before the swing or not, longer leader versus shorter leader, heavy fly versus lighter fly, the angle and height of your rod tip during the swing…All of these things create meaningful variables without having to change your tip.
Great thread, and the floating line and NO tip in high waters on one of my home rivers (st. joe) is exactly what I've used to pluck one from near the bank. several times. its wierd, because a lot of times i find that im setting up really early in the swing jsut to maximize that moment.... for that narrow wedge that is in the last 25% of the swing....im convinced its not an accident.
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post #13 of 14 (permalink) Old 03-11-2018, 02:59 PM
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Donít forget about the standing in the middle of the river and casting into the soft water and letting it swing into the middle of the current! That will swing your fly in the opposite direction as your first approach and give you a different angle as well as a different dangle depending on where you end your rod tip. (Also donít be afraid to fish short, sometimes with barely more than your sink tip all the way out of the eyes of your rod!!)

Why is my fly shop only open during regular fishing hours...
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post #14 of 14 (permalink) Old 03-11-2018, 09:31 PM
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What he means

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Originally Posted by fisshman26 View Post
To make the end of your line move in shore in most conditions including what you describe, simply at the end of the natural swing with the current.... and the line stops..... slowly move your rod tip (ie. no jerky movements) out towards the centre of the river.
This works with full floaters and sink tips
Keep the rod tip low, leaving the maximum amount of line on the water. By moving the rod tip out towards the center of the river you are in effect, pulling the fly in towards your bank. Don't wait for it to stop, rather keep the fly moving at a steady pace.
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