Am I doing it right? - Spey Pages
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post #1 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-15-2018, 02:17 PM Thread Starter
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Am I doing it right?

So, I want to build a rod for trout spey, using the rod primarily for swinging wets, streamers, possibly stripping for streamers and the occasional nymphing with an indicator. Trout not bigger than 20” for the most part. I like simplicity so want an all around rod and non-complicated line system. My plan is to buy either/both the ARE IM6 3/4 11ft 3pc and/or 10ft 3pc. I am thinking about purchasing a Rio Switch Chucker (not sure of size) so I have an integrated head to which I can attach poly leaders in floating, intermediate and sink to use for the aforementioned purposes. Am I out of line here? Can the same line work for both rod lengths? As a newby to this world, I look to those who are knowledgeable. Many thanks for info offered. Roy
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post #2 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-15-2018, 04:22 PM
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I would love to catch a 20" trout on my 11' 3/4 . I love that little rod.

There is a good article called "In Defense of Switch Lines" on the Headhunters website you can Google. Basically, if you want to swing, buy spey lines. If you want to indicator nymph, buy something like the switch chucker. Maybe try Steve Godshall custom line?

One thing and this is just me, I wouldn't go 10'. When I have gotten into waist deep water, I have often wished for a longer rod.

Switch chucker is $100. A spey head is ~$60. You're going to have some tips, polyleaders either way. I would just buy another spool for my reel and have one set up for the switch chucker and another set up for spey. I understand about being frugal, but don't cheap out so much that the casting/fishing experience is frustrating. You'll just end up spending more money than you had planned in the first place to get it right...

Keep 'em wet
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post #3 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-15-2018, 06:01 PM
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If I were starting from scratch with a trout spey, think I’d get either the new SA spey light skagit line (if you want integrated) or an OPST Commando (if you don’t mind the separate runner), then get a set of 3 OPST sink tips and the OPST 10ft floating tip. That way you can loop on the float tip with a mono leader and use it like a scandi head, or switch to the sink tips for bigger flies and getting deeper.
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post #4 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-15-2018, 06:27 PM Thread Starter
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Trouter - what line(s) do you use on your 3/4? What grain head do you us? Seems like skagit is for distance and Scandi for presentation. Seems I could literally spend $300 to $400 just on lines, leaders, tips, etc.
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post #5 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-15-2018, 06:32 PM Thread Starter
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David - my preference is an integrated line. Why the skagit vs the Scandi? Suggestions on the grain weight? I see that they start at 150.
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post #6 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-15-2018, 07:18 PM
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You could spend a lot on lines...I have...

240 grain Skagit Scout with mono running line. I cast 10 T8 and 5/5 light MOW tips.
5Wt (215 grain) Wulff Ambush for smaller and lighter flies - soft hackles, small wets. Use 10' floating or intermediate polyleader. Or you could just regular 9-12' tapered mono leader.

Unfortunately, you have to try them. What I like may be completely different from what you like. There is a local shop in Sacramento that will let you "check out" lines and take them down to the river to try out. Try before you buy if you will. If you could find a shop in your area that'll let you do that, that could save you some $. Or if you could find a local casting / fly fishing club and cozy up to the spey people, they all have too many lines and may agree to bring a couple for you to try out.

Keep 'em wet
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post #7 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-15-2018, 07:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Retiredfisher1 View Post
David - my preference is an integrated line. Why the skagit vs the Scandi? Suggestions on the grain weight? I see that they start at 150.
The skagit with the floating tip basically becomes a scandi. Here’s the OPST promo video about the float tips:
It’s about the single hand versions but same principle involved.

Ps - note he’s using glass!
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post #8 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-15-2018, 07:51 PM
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Scandi leans towards a finer presentation, smaller flies (than skagit).

Skagit is for hauling freight (heavier tips, larger flies). Of course there's some crossover in the middle.

A good possibility would be a Skandit from Steve Godshall. He'll dial in the grain weight for you- it's a scandi set up whit a removable tip. The remaining body can be fished like a skagit- ad tips to carry heavier flies.
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Last edited by SLSS; 01-17-2018 at 02:47 AM.
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post #9 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-15-2018, 08:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SLSS View Post
Scandi leans towards a finger presentation, smaller flies (than skagit).

Skagit is for hauling freight (heavier tips, larger flies). Of course there's some crossover in the middle.

A good possibility would be a Skandit from Steve Godshall. He'll dial in the grain weight for you- it's a scandi set up whit a removable tip. The remaining body can be fished like a skagit- ad tips to carry heavier flies.
What he said! Basically the same principle as I was talking about above. OPST’s heads are shorter than Steve’s but otherwise the same idea.

(NB - I’m faaaar from being as experienced/accomplished a spey angler as most here, but I’ve had a lot of success and fun with the OPST stuff on my local waters)
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post #10 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-15-2018, 11:52 PM
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If it were me I’d get one of Steve Godshall’s SGS scandi line’s for use with 55-75gr tips. Steve knows those rods and the line will match the rod and designated tips perfectly, and will cast almost anything you fish for trout. The microskagits are super easy and forgiving to cast, but one of Steve’s scandis is elegant and silky smooth. A lot of time people say “get a scandi and a skagit head for a rod and you are done”, and these two choices are the trouting equivalents. For any trout rod a scandi that uses tips is, for me, the only indispensable line. I hardly ever need or want to use something more clunky. Seems somehow wrong to be casting a #14 soft hackle on a line more designed to cast mouse flies.

Anyway, just something to consider. But definitely do yourself a favor, and one that could potentially have major repercussions way beyond your current project, and definitely call Steve and have a 20 minute chat about this stuff. He’s a very generous guy with his time, and absolutely loves to help people just starting to explore a new area!

Also, the ARE 12’ 2/3 is the true cult one! You can throw $60 in the gutter, or get a couple of other blanks to play with. Get two of the same blank and make and extra tip section for back up. The make a SH butt section (or micro 2 hander) out of the extra section 2 and and you will have a conversion rod that can turn into a 9’ SH rod. All for peanuts.

“Gravity is a harsh mistress!”, The Tick
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post #11 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-16-2018, 08:53 PM
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Maybe don't rule out the idea of single hand spey. I'd be really tempted to tell you to build a 10-10.5' 6 wt single hander and get a 250 commando head on it. Or maybe 10' 5 wt and 225 grain. I am currently using a 10' 7 wt Sage RPL with a 300 grain home cooked commando style head and 12' type 6 sink tip. I can cast it 80-90 ft with no false cast - it's an absolute blast. It's perfect for steelhead, but way too much gun for trout. The single hand spey deal is incredible. Biggest breakthrough in my fishing since I took up the 2-hander. The advantage of these rods drop off on bigger open rivers. But if you are in tight spots with brush they are a fantastic tool

Cheers,

-John
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post #12 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-26-2018, 11:27 AM
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The switch chucker IMHO is the easiest line for a newbie. I have an old reel that I have the 5wt version on. I loan it to friends that want to lean the 2-hand game. I have not found a line that works better when running indicators between swinging runs. I know this is frowned upon by many here and it is not something I do anymore. I am on the oars 95% of the time and I am trying to get friends into the sport. Anyway, the chucker can be easily roll casted from the front seat of the raft and perry poked for more distance with very little effort. I tried out the Rio Switch line and it was not nearly as effective. As your addiction progresses (and it will) you will find yourself on the phone with Steve ordering a scandi line specific to your rod. Enjoy the obsession
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post #13 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-26-2018, 02:01 PM Thread Starter
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Echman - I have ordered both the 10 and 11 foot ARE 3/4 blanks. With that in mind, is there a preference of which weight switch chucker is better? I have also been seriously thinking about the SA lite Scandi integrated line with some tips. Thoughts? Thanks, Roy
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post #14 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-26-2018, 02:53 PM
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I have been fishing two handed trout rods for some time now. I have boiled it down to swing classic wet flies being my preferred method. I use the two hander on both small and larger streams. Provo River size to the South Fork of the Snake. I have tried every line system conceivable. Some systems did real well for larger streamers, but were clunky for swinging small wets. I also have found 30 to 40 foot casts are plenty good for trout. I ended up liking a line that handles a team of wet flies without a problem and one that I did not need to strip in running line to make a cast. The Wulff Triangle and Ambush lines work very well. I would build you rod and then try some of the fly lines you may already have. A WF 5 or 6 will load a 3 weight with out much effort. Just remember the load of the rod is created by two forces. The weight of the fly line and friction from the surface of the water. The longer heads require less line mass, where the shorted head require more line mass. Long and skinny or short and fat. Like all systems, there is not one that will do it all. The system I use will accept larger, 4 inch plus streamers, but it not fun. Fishing a team of wet flies though is a pure dream. The spare spool is showing a strong comeback. Having options out on the water makes for a better day. Kind of like steelheading. The system I use for dry lining a size 4 on the Deschutes is completely different than the one I use in the winter when the rivers are high and off color. Good luck with your adventure, sound like an awesome plan.
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