Learning to Spey Cast with Switch Rod? - Spey Pages
 
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post #1 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-10-2008, 04:01 PM Thread Starter
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Learning to Spey Cast with Switch Rod?

Hey Guys,
Recently, I bought the ZA 7110 and would like to learn to spey with this rod. I mostly fish small streams so what interests me is the change of direction more than distance casting. I did take my first spey instruction class last weekend and have watched the Rio 3 DVD set. These were helpful but not specific as to learning to spey with the switch rod. Any tips?
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post #2 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-10-2008, 04:09 PM
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You might find this video helpful

http://jpflyfishing.com/video/index.html
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post #3 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-10-2008, 06:38 PM
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On your Rio DVD

Watch the skagit casting and perry poke chapters. You can get by with the perry poke and double spey for starters. Start with a line 2.5-3x your rod length. Wear something to protect your eyes. Set your anchors close.
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post #4 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-10-2008, 07:02 PM
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my .02

your casting stroke has to be very tight and dialed in with a shorter rod. Also, make sure that the lines you are casting don't have too long of a head or taper (read under 38'). They are great tools for smaller streams with a lot of brush, but switch rods are harder to learn two-handed casts with than 13-15' rods. good luck
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post #5 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-10-2008, 09:56 PM Thread Starter
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Any specific line advice? I have been using the Sage Indy line, which was designed for the rod but I don't believe for spey casting. I was thinking of getting a Rio Skagit line. However, if I need to be between 33 to 38.5 ft total do I need to then remove 5 feet from my 15 ft Rio sinktips?
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post #6 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-10-2008, 11:12 PM
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I wouldn't bother with the 15' tips. Either get the fastest 10' poly leader you can find, or buy the airflo custom cut t-10. Start out shorter than 3.5x rod length. 3x or less will help you with your anchor placement. I'm guessing that rod would handle around 350-400gr with a 60-80gr tip. I remember thinking it was a pretty macho 7wt.
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post #7 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-11-2008, 02:50 AM
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Don't bother

You really don't have to go any further than the new Beulah Elixir lines...there lines are designed specifically for your needs and the needs of the proficient casters... either in a Spey Rod version and a Switch rod version...
It won't be long before the large Line manufacturers pick up on the efficiencies of these lines and offer something similar...pick up a couple of different poly tips from floating to fast sink (lengths from 16-10 feet) and you are away to the races. Useing a Switch rod for Spey casts is what they are designed for. Too many casters keep the strokes to short and are snapping the forward stroke...you have lots of time and when you run into difficulties position your rod at about 1:30 off your shoulder...a lot safer that way and definitely more fun.
I was working a 10'6" 7/8 Switch rod yesterday here on Vancouver Island in some deep and fast water . The rod was matched with the correct Elixir line,but the caster was not proficient yet,but stated he was and has been having a very good time with it. His error was "too fast" and the rod was coming too straight off or vertical off his shoulders,causeing the line to continue behind him, consequently a powerless loop and no feel of the load.


After viewing his technique for a moment the apparent flaw in his stroke was his set-up for forming the Loop. He set-up much tooooo early,thus instead of having a smooth "White Mouse" speed he was developeing a serious "Rat" speed, in which commanded his rod tip to come well behind his body. A very common issue ...watch for it... and have fun
C
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post #8 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-11-2008, 04:44 PM Thread Starter
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Appreciate all the help. I still have a few Cabelas gift cert to burn so I'll go with a Rio Skagit 400 and make a few short sinking tips.
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post #9 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-13-2008, 03:33 AM
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Notes

Learning on Switch is not much different that leaning to Speycast one Long rod. Except for on thing the longer the rod the faster you can move.
Example if you were learning a Cast on 14 ft rod you can move a lot faster though out the basic moves than with a 6ft rod. So the shorter rod is less forgiving to errors in timing and judgment.
Remember slow is a relative term when dealing with fly-casting.
Here we are dealing with Speyrod not Sprayrod if you have spray coming off your line in most of the movements you may be going to fast.
Go fast enoght to hold tenstion yet slow enought to keep control.
The shower you can cast the faster you will learn.
He who casts slowest wins.
The rod path into the forward cast of switch cast is one of the big problems. Keeping the anchor path parallel with your forward cast path and at no time should they cross. I you us the analogy of set of Railroad and you know that Railroad tracks never cross.
Think as the Switch cast, Jump roll cast, Or the forward Spey as you platform to build the rest of cast off.
So set the cast accordingly starting in with the Railroad tracks in mind and once you understand the rod paths to get this the rest will come easy.

A simple Double Spey could be made in three movements, upstream sweep( or what every you want to call it) ,down stream sweep ( or what every you want to call it) and circle up in to the Switch cast.
I know there are a lot of variations to Spey casts.
But all Spey cast can be broke down into two distinct parts: the line maneuvering work, which we do, to alien the anchor parallel with our forward cast path and so we can make a back cast to the key position.
Once we are in the key position we just make a forward cast.
We need the forward cast path 180 degrees from our back cast.

As for lines I believe in the fact that there is no on line that is the best line for everyone.
A lot of companies are building highbred tapers and claiming outstanding performance.
The only thing I look at performance and durably. Check what lines those people who have the most gain by the best performance in the lines are using. If you get a chance to go some place to try a few lines.

"Just A Trim-Tab." Buckminster Fuller

*Service is the rent we pay for the privilege of living on this earth - N.Eldon Tanner.

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post #10 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-14-2008, 03:22 PM Thread Starter
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Good advice which I read a little late. After I slashed a hole in my Simms with an Intruder, I slowed and powered down. I realize that I should not have a fly on my line but when I see steel jumping, I simply could not resist.
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post #11 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-14-2008, 06:46 PM
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Hitting yourself with a few intruders is one way to learn not to hit youself. That's how I learned. The most memorable one was actually when Mike McCune was giving me some pointers on the Grand Ronde. I b**ch-slapped myself with a large, weighted leech on a 650gr skagit line. Right across the face. I was stunned for a sec or two, real quiet, then managed to mumble, "that sucked." I'm pretty sure Mike was trying not to burst out laughing once he knew I hadn't hurt myself.

Anyways, try to remember that you are casting the FLY. It's increasingly important as the flies you use get larger and heavier, so know where it is and where it's headed at all times. You might try an bright, light colored intruder without a hook. You'll be able to keep an eye on it through the anchor set and into the cast. It'll be visible underwater. Eventually, you'll develop an instinct for whether you're gonna get whacked or not. With time, you'll learn to set up safe casts. I do think it's better to learn to cast with what you intend to cast, though. Just don't injure an eye in the process...
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post #12 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-14-2008, 09:28 PM Thread Starter
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Glasses were in place but I need to wear a cup next time. I was casting in very tight places and could only cast from the right bank as the river was high. The 400 gr Skagit with the 10 ft type 8 sinktip was not easy to cast with a bush 5 ft upstream, a tree 10 ft downstream and a high bank behind me. However, I was happy that I had a few decent double spey casts and all my body parts were still intact at the end. I need lots of practice but I am very optimistic!
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post #13 of 14 (permalink) Old 01-16-2008, 04:26 AM
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Better to hit you self that the Instructor.

Man do I hate that !

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post #14 of 14 (permalink) Old 02-03-2008, 09:18 PM
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HI,

I fish a Windcutter 6/7/8 on my T&T 1107's with tips cut back to 13'. Great for a "long belly" switch line, but then I single spey whenever possible. Have also cast a Beulah Elixir (sweet). Hoping to try other short head lines at the Sandy spey clave.

Cheers,


Rob
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