Skagit Casting on Grass - Spey Pages
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post #1 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-22-2007, 02:15 PM Thread Starter
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Skagit Casting on Grass

Can all of the skagit casts be executed on grass even though they are not the kiss and go casting of traditional spey casting? Do you use the same grass leader as you do for the traditional kiss and go casting? Is the grass in any way harmful to your line such as cutting it? Thanks very much.

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post #2 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-22-2007, 02:37 PM
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Can all of the skagit casts be executed on grass such as cutting it?
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post #3 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-22-2007, 02:58 PM
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Skagit...

it's probably because of the sustained anchor of a Skagit cast that makes them ideal for practice on grass.

Grass is for practice when you can't get to the water, or you don't want to 'cut' the water to a foam with the practising when there may be some fishermen trying to fish (rather than practice casting).

Thus, use the same rod/line/tip/leader/tippet you would be using on the water, and some sort of fly minus the hook - I would use a small tube, or an intruder with its trailing hook would be ideal. As you are out for practice, you may wish to experiment with not only the style & timing of casts, but different rod/line/leader set-ups.

And no, you won't damage your gear on just grass, and you would have to make many thousands of casts to impact on the grass height itself!

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post #4 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-22-2007, 03:59 PM
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I would suggest you clean the line after casting on grass if casting in a park or someplace where they may be using lawn supplements.

While I suggest this, I rarely do this!!!
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post #5 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-22-2007, 06:51 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks folks--I'll give it a go!

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post #6 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-22-2007, 07:58 PM
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So, one should be able to test potential skagit line/rod combos on grass, w/ just a normal leader and expect it to translate to the water?

That surprising but great news, and unexpected. I will now be able to test my lines/rods when I am not able to travel to water, don waders, etc.

Thanks!
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post #7 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-23-2007, 12:02 AM
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I was waiting for the Skagit jedis to weigh in here as I have never tried Skagit lines on grass. My expectation though is that it would not work well. If one wanted to simulate the anchor of water on a Skagit line and a heavy tip, I woiuld guess you would need a very radical grass leader and maybe even then you wouldn't get it. A grass leader and a longer bellied line works as you are only looking for limited stick for touch and go casting. I just don't think you can get the sustained load with a Skagit but like I said, I have never tried it so I could be very wrong. It has been known to occur.

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post #8 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-23-2007, 01:34 AM
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Ed casts on the grass all the time!It would not suprise me if he was casting on the grass in Texas so he can maintain his form!Beau
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post #9 of 17 (permalink) Old 03-16-2007, 01:05 PM
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I was teaching my son last week to skagit cast and found it can be done. You just need to add a cheater length of 15' mono between the fly line and the 30# stiff mono grass leader (around 10').

This cheater keeps the leader flat to the grass so there is grab during the fwd cast.

Without a cheater, part of the leader will be inclined (or pick up too early before max rod tip acceleration), giving not enough anchor.

Grass leaders are great for hooking squirrels high in the tree.

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post #10 of 17 (permalink) Old 11-02-2009, 01:30 PM
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Ed's new DVD shows him casting grass and how to do it

Quote:
Originally Posted by sinktip View Post
I was waiting for the Skagit jedis to weigh in here as I have never tried Skagit lines on grass. My expectation though is that it would not work well. If one wanted to simulate the anchor of water on a Skagit line and a heavy tip, I woiuld guess you would need a very radical grass leader and maybe even then you wouldn't get it. A grass leader and a longer bellied line works as you are only looking for limited stick for touch and go casting. I just don't think you can get the sustained load with a Skagit but like I said, I have never tried it so I could be very wrong. It has been known to occur.
Ed's new DVD, Skagit Master, has an interesting chapter/section on Skagit casting on grass.

I have a park with excellent grass about 3-5 minutes away versus at least an hour of hard driving to test lines and practice casting.

Nothing beats being on the water, however with the price of gas and not wanting to disturb other fishers when I'm trying a new line or rod or something different. The grass works, and the price is right. I have found if a line/leader/tip set up works on the grass, it will work in the water. If it doesn't work on the grass re loading the rod, it will not work in the water.

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post #11 of 17 (permalink) Old 11-02-2009, 11:32 PM
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Since the video came out I have been on the practicing on the grass almost daily. Yes you can practice all of the sustained anchor cast that I know of. I had to make the grass leader a couple of feet longer to help maintain the load on the rod. Practicing on the grass has been extremely helpful. It also force's you to slow down.

I was also able to pick out the general line weight for a rod and at least get a feel for it.
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post #12 of 17 (permalink) Old 11-03-2009, 12:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by herl View Post
So, one should be able to test potential skagit line/rod combos on grass, w/ just a normal leader and expect it to translate to the water?

That surprising but great news, and unexpected. I will now be able to test my lines/rods when I am not able to travel to water, don waders, etc.

Thanks!
close but not exactly, Herl.
I find that grass casting is great for working on practicing the forward cast especially, and that weights correspond OK, but that you really need that water stick to pull it all together in a realistic way. Nothing accurately simulates water tension-- especially when you're practicing with anchor placement and loading the rod on the sweep, the essence of skagit.
One thing that does help on grass is to use the heaviest tip you have, slow down, and focus on the precision of your motions rather than increased energy.
Hope I said that right.
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post #13 of 17 (permalink) Old 11-15-2009, 10:54 AM
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Grass casting...

...is workable with all the Sustained Anchor (SA) casts. Don't expect "picture perfect" casts though, because the anchoring of the line is not exactly the same type of resistance displayed by actual water - the grass has higher "slippage".

The values of grass casting are in the facts that: #1 - the act of "fishing" is removed from the practice setting, thus 100% of one's focus can be on the casting: #2 - no "current" means that casts can be stopped mid-process to allow the checking of line positions as references for correct procedure: #3 - the "slippage" of grass greatly reinforces the need to slow down the casting process and rely on technique rather than "muscle".

Tips:
1 - longer grass leaders than the suggested 10' may be necessary for some types of grass.
2 - putting a sinktip onto the line seems to make for a more similar feel to water than a straight floater.
3 - phenomonal grass casting can be had by dedicating a line just for grass casting. This basically involves acquiring a line that is a bit longer than that used on the water, and somewhat heavier (about 100 grains heavier is a good starting point for 8 and 9 weights).

Suggested practice focus:
1 - concentrate on the Load Sequence. This is the most important, core part of the Skagit casting procedure. The prior step, the Pickup, is easily tuned on the water with enough rod time, and the fact is that not-so-perfect Pickups will still produce good casts provided that the Load Sequence is correct. As regards the other end of the casting procedure, the Forward Casting Stroke is in itself worthless without a solid Load Sequence. However, properly loading a rod will still produce a cast even if the Forward Casting Stroke is not totally "correct". So, let me reiterate - FOCUS ON THE LOADING SEQUENCE.
2 - The three main components of the Loading Sequence to practice, and in the order that they should be concentrated upon are - flat plane movements, out and around motion, and instantaneous start.

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post #14 of 17 (permalink) Old 11-15-2009, 11:11 AM
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Ed, usual thanks.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Riveraddict View Post
...is workable with all the Sustained Anchor (SA) casts. Don't expect "picture perfect" casts though, because the anchoring of the line is not exactly the same type of resistance displayed by actual water - the grass has higher "slippage".

The values of grass casting are in the facts that: #1 - the act of "fishing" is removed from the practice setting, thus 100% of one's focus can be on the casting: #2 - no "current" means that casts can be stopped mid-process to allow the checking of line positions as references for correct procedure: #3 - the "slippage" of grass greatly reinforces the need to slow down the casting process and rely on technique rather than "muscle".

Tips:
1 - longer grass leaders than the suggested 10' may be necessary for some types of grass.
2 - putting a sinktip onto the line seems to make for a more similar feel to water than a straight floater.
3 - phenomonal grass casting can be had by dedicating a line just for grass casting. This basically involves acquiring a line that is a bit longer than that used on the water, and somewhat heavier (about 100 grains heavier is a good starting point for 8 and 9 weights).

Suggested practice focus:
1 - concentrate on the Load Sequence. This is the most important, core part of the Skagit casting procedure. The prior step, the Pickup, is easily tuned on the water with enough rod time, and the fact is that not-so-perfect Pickups will still produce good casts provided that the Load Sequence is correct. As regards the other end of the casting procedure, the Forward Casting Stroke is in itself worthless without a solid Load Sequence. However, properly loading a rod will still produce a cast even if the Forward Casting Stroke is not totally "correct". So, let me reiterate - FOCUS ON THE LOADING SEQUENCE.
2 - The three main components of the Loading Sequence to practice, and in the order that they should be concentrated upon are - flat plane movements, out and around motion, and instantaneous start.
I use the intermediate Poly Leaders on grass 7 and 10' leaders and about 3' of tippet work. I use a size 4-6 fly without the bottom of the hook removed.

One thing stands out. If a line/leader/tip combo doesn't work on the grass, it probably will not work in the water.

Focusing on the loading sequence in grass, helps to focus on the loading sequence in water.

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post #15 of 17 (permalink) Old 11-15-2009, 01:17 PM
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casting on grass

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Originally Posted by Rick J View Post
I would suggest you clean the line after casting on grass if casting in a park or someplace where they may be using lawn supplements.

Yes, clean the line....'cause my dog likes to leave 'supplements' on my lawn.
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