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How Do You Know When A Line Is Too Heavy

5K views 15 replies 15 participants last post by  fish0n4evr 
#1 ·
Probably stupid question territory, but how do you know when a line is too heavy. I know if the rod snaps in two I had too much weight. What are the subtle differences one feels or looks for between just right and too much?

Thanks for any comments, Leo.
 
#4 ·
Well definitely don’t take my word on anything but... if it feels “too heavy” it probably is. Since this is the internet, and that could easily be misconstrued as being snarky, I mean that quite literally. My limited experiences of having a line that was “too heavy” felt EXACTLY “too heavy”. More often I’ve had the other issue, where I personally just didn’t feel the line loading the rod the way I like. My intuition tells me that comments about this being subjective are spot on, and looking at the recommended grain window of the rods where the makers provide them pretty much confirms this. “Too heavy” for me might not be for you, etc. For an average beginner to novice it really makes sense for someone with more experience to set them up with a “correct” matching rod and line set up; but, beyond that I think it starts getting simultaneously more open/subjective and more specific/personal.

This deeply specific personal taste probably helps account for quite a few confused newbies...and quite a few extra line sales for the manufacturers. In the beginning, I think we tend to tailor our technique to the equipment we have; later, I think it’s more the other way around.
JB
 
#5 ·
When Skagit lines came along, many users espoused Skagit line/tip combos that would "make the rod bend to the corks." I don't, although I want the Skagit rig to feel unapologeticly authoritative. I want it, like any other kind of spey line, to feel comfortable. Strokes feel better than punches.

And casting a heavy-for-the-rod line a few hundred or thousand times may well loosen the corks and their glue connections, although I haven't experienced such a crisis.
 
#6 ·
I don't want to be held responsible for your broken equipment, so this is your warning... Only try this on a rod you don't care about...

Put a 7wt 500gr skagit head on a 6wt rod that normally likes a 425gr skagit and you'll know right away. I had the same question, so I tried it. I had to slow down a painful amount, just so the rod wouldn't collapse. I haven't done it since, and I never will. I didn't break the rod, but it felt like it wasn't far off. I can't see any practical reason that someone would do this to their rod, it takes more effort to cast, and performance is severely reduced.
 
#8 ·
I kinda agree with SSLS's comment on sluggishness, but I've also casted line/rod combinations that technically were not overloaded, but felt sluggish anyway. I believe it has to do with weight distribution within the head...

Extreme example:
Same rod, casting strokes, leader, & fly...

First cast a LEVEL head that measures overall, 375 grains × 30'.
Next cast a TAPERED head that is overall 375 grains × 30', but 70% of the head's weight is in the rear half.
Casting the 2nd head will probably feel significantly heavier, some may even say to the point of overlining the rod.

IMO this is part of what causes some of us to spend so much thought/time/money/effort in trying to find the perfect line for a given rod, that performs perfectly for our casting stroke and/or in a certain fishing situation.

Others just say, "Yep, this line was on sale." and they go fish it.

Who is happier?

Jason's last paragraph sums up my experience nicely:
This deeply specific personal taste probably helps account for quite a few confused newbies...and quite a few extra line sales for the manufacturers. In the beginning, I think we tend to tailor our technique to the equipment we have; later, I think it’s more the other way around.
JB
 
#9 ·
In addition to the previously mentioned, you might also feel the tip section get squirrelly, easily come off track or easily collapses (tailing or tailing tendency loop).

I'm clear on the other side of the spectrum preferring light line setups, small flies and rods that straighten quick with high line speed.
 
#12 ·
If I can't lift a line easily off the water and sweep effortlessly every time, the damn thing is probably too heavy.

When it comes to Skagit heads/tips, I like to say, "If I can't single spey it, it's too heavy." Now is the single going to be as clean as one performed with a true Spey head or Scandi? No. But I still want all my lines to comfortably single and snake at my leisure.
 
#15 ·
Great stuff on this whole thread! I’ve learned a lot by reading the responses!

I like what you said here V-loop, I too like to be able to single spey my skagit heads!

I also wonder if rod action plays into the subjective feel??? Stupid statement probably, (like duh, of course) but what I mean is this: I recently picked up a T&T DH1510-5. Yep, I bought it for 15’ of T whatever, large chinook flies, and hopefully huge fish!! But, it’s a massive but section on the rod, and I want a 750gr skagit head on it. I gotta ‘feel’ it man, and it can be hard to ‘feel’ it in rods like that. I’m not outside the grain window per say, but definitely on the ‘heavy’ side. But I don’t care, I like it on that stick! Now, on my echo King rod I actually went lighter.......I don’t care for a sluggish feeling.

What I’m struggling to say here is I basically look at a grain window, maybe see what others have thrown, and I’ll test out different lines within a 100gr window until I find what I like. I don’t really care at that point whether it’s light or heavy for the rec, if I like it I fish it.

I dunno, just some ramblings from an Amatuer
 
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#16 ·
Leo,
I know that the heavier the line goes the slower the rods recovery will become, and I know when a line is too heavy for my taste. I don't know what is too heavy for a rod though - I've never experimented/experienced that way.

From some of the responses here and what Ive seen in vids where the heavy rear end of a line drops before the fly turns over then there must be a lot overlying of rods going on out there. But Im betting it has more to do with technique, or maybe too heavy for the caster, but less with the line weight being too heavy for a rod.
 
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