Waxing ferrules - Spey Pages
 13Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
post #1 of 30 (permalink) Old 10-18-2019, 10:16 AM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: USA
Posts: 216
Waxing ferrules

This question may seem a little dumb, but please bear with me.
I am wondering if there are specific types of wax that should be used or more specifically, not used on ferrules?
I found two bars of Swix X-country ski wax that has been laying around for years and was hoping it was ok to use to
wax the ferrules on my rods. Any thoughts? If this is OK then I have enough wax to last forever. Also, how about as tying wax?

Any help is appreciated.

Thanks
Emel
Emel is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 30 (permalink) Old 10-18-2019, 11:40 AM
Administrator
 
GR8LAKES FLYER's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: All Rivers flowing into Georgian Bay
Posts: 16,595
I've used candle wax and it has worked with no issues.
Steve Godshall's new wax is brilliant.
As far as what not to use, I would suggest not to use wax with any additives for lubrication or is moisture wicking.


Mike

Have you Swung a Spey Fly today ??
GR8LAKES FLYER is offline  
post #3 of 30 (permalink) Old 10-18-2019, 12:02 PM
Registered User
 
SalmonCane's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Any Atlantic Salmon Water
Posts: 440
I'm sure there are many alternatives that work. I personally use LOON ferrule wax, which is in a handy little flip top container. It is probably more expensive than others, but se ems like it would last forever and works great. I haven't had any loose ferrules since I started using it.
SalmonCane is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 30 (permalink) Old 10-18-2019, 12:36 PM
JD
 
JDJones's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Rogue River State of Jefferson
Posts: 3,571
What you don't'want is paraffin wax used for canning. It is too hard & will lock the ferrules so tight you will not be able to disassemble the rod at the end of the day. Twenty years ago, I sliced a hockey puck thickness off the bottom of one of wifey's Christmas candles. In addition to the perfume, which drives me nuts, those things have other additives making the wax softer. I cut that "hockey puck" in half & gave one of the halves to a fishing buddy. I'm still working on the other half.
RazKaL likes this.

I fish because the voices inside my head tell me to.
JDJones is offline  
post #5 of 30 (permalink) Old 10-18-2019, 01:24 PM
Registered User
 
Cowboy Tom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Methow River
Posts: 821
Emel,

I've used Swix BP88 (base prep red) wax in the past and it was super grippy, even on a hot day. Don't think I want to try it in the winter. I would only recommend it for hot summer days when most of the others get soft, and consequently slick...ferrules loosen more easily. In the winter I use bees wax (same stuff I use on my longbow strings). It holds well when its cold but still possible to get the sections apart. Bees wax is way too soft and melts too easily when it's hot. Conversely, candle wax can be a little too stickly in cold weather for my taste. If you want to try the ski wax I would suggest starting with a warm wax with no additives, spread very thin and see how it goes...and let us know how it goes. Stay away from the flouro stuff. Too expensive anyway. Think I'm going to try a few different ski waxes next summer as my candle wax gets a little soft on really hot days. Personally, I'm not too worried about what is in the basic waxes. Our local Swix rep actually bites chunks out of the bars and chews on them at shows to drive home the point that the basic blue/red/yellow waxes are organic.

I see you're a shvingger too!

Tom McCoy

Bruce and Walker North America - Pro Staff
Cowboy Tom is online now  
post #6 of 30 (permalink) Old 10-18-2019, 01:43 PM
Registered User
 
eriefisher's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Lower Grand River, Saugeen and everything else wet.
Posts: 855
I use a bow string wax. Why? It's what I could get my hands on at the time. Convenient twist tube to apply when needed. In the colder weather should they be too tight I just use the palm of my hand to warm the ferrule a bit and it slides right off. I also clean the wax off fairly regularly inside and out just in case any debris is stuck to it. A small amount of grit stuck in the wax can be hell on a blank.

Dan
kalamaman likes this.

Which way to the river?
eriefisher is online now  
post #7 of 30 (permalink) Old 10-18-2019, 02:04 PM
Registered User
 
steelhd32's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: VA, NY, MT
Posts: 502
ferrule wax

Quote:
Originally Posted by SalmonCane View Post
I'm sure there are many alternatives that work. I personally use LOON ferrule wax, which is in a handy little flip top container. It is probably more expensive than others, but se ems like it would last forever and works great. I haven't had any loose ferrules since I started using it.
When you say loose, does that also mean that the rod sections are not twisting?

I can't understand why some folks think a drink can is harder to carry out when it is empty than it was to carry in when it was full.
steelhd32 is offline  
post #8 of 30 (permalink) Old 10-18-2019, 02:08 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Skykomish
Posts: 88
Serious question; in today's world of modern rods, etc., why are people waxing ferrules? I haven't done this in 22 years of fishing with a long rod and haven't had any issues with any of my rods that I know of. Am I missing damage that I am not seeing?
Hardyreels likes this.
circlespey is online now  
post #9 of 30 (permalink) Old 10-18-2019, 02:43 PM
Registered User
 
SalmonCane's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Any Atlantic Salmon Water
Posts: 440
Quote:
Originally Posted by steelhd32 View Post
When you say loose, does that also mean that the rod sections are not twisting?
Yes. I meant that with the wax, when spey casting the ferrules don't seem to twist and loosen. I used to tape ferrules, but some recommend against that so started using the wax. I still check ferrule fit periodically during a days session, but the wax seems to keep things tight. And with the LOON wax, I don't seem to have trouble with disassembly when I take the rod down.
Leo M and Emel like this.
SalmonCane is online now  
post #10 of 30 (permalink) Old 10-18-2019, 03:36 PM
Registered User
 
Botsari's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Northern California
Posts: 2,979
There ARE specific mixtures for wax that are more recommended than other. Soft is good because you want to have it make a smooth thin layer. Bot super soft is probably not good either. What the wax does it lowers the high static coefficient of friction, and that is as helpful in modern rod/ferules as on old rods. But is a matter of taste, not a necessity.

As to some of question/comments raised by other posts, the static coefficient of friction is usually higher that the sliding coefficient, and this leads to the “stickiness” you feel initially when to open a jar for example. I think there are two things people who like to wax point to. First, with the static coefficient of friction lowered you can press the ferrule together as hard as you want and it will tighten in proportion to the amount of force you used in putting them together, and not “hang up” like a sticky jar lid. Once assembled you can twist them apart again smoothly, anD usually with the same force you used to put them together. The wax allows you in essence to rely on a known sliding friction and not on an unknown static friction. This is why it can help with both keeping the ferrules together AND getting them apart.

Second, with the wax the ferrules tend not to fail catastrophically like the jar lid suddenly coming undone. They will twist a little first with the wax, but with a sticky connection there is more of a chance when the two part come apart they will become very loose. That is the situation where you can break a rod at the ferrule. It’s not super common but it is the number one reason a rod can break while casting.

For what it’s worth I wax AND tape because I’m not that confident I can put enough pressure on the ferrule initially to make sure it can stand up to the large twist forces when spey casting with all the circular motions. You still need to keep an eye on things, but the tape also insures you will never break a rod even if it starts to twist and you are absorbed in another activity ... like fishing.

I’m another person that really likes the black Loon stuff because it is a soft mixture and easy to get a very smooth thin layer with your fingers. But I’m going to have to try the new stuff from Steve next time I get something from him. At any rate whatever you decide to use it will probably last you virtually forever, or until you loose it rather than run out.

The right tape will neither harm the finish of the rod or leave residue by the way. I know Tim Rajeff rails against tape, but that may be because some of the Echo rods have the alignment dots cheaply done on the outside of the epoxy finish, rather then under it. Those will slowly come off using tape, but otherwise he is actually (for once) completely full of it. The right tape is vinyl electric tape. The stuff I use on advice from someone who tested them (I think), is 3M brand 33+ electrical tape. I’ve used it many hundreds times on some of the most expensive, and some of the cheapest rods out there and there is zero effect on the actual finish.
SimonD likes this.

“Gravity is a harsh mistress!”, The Tick
Botsari is offline  
post #11 of 30 (permalink) Old 10-18-2019, 03:57 PM
Dedicated Fisherman
 
Hardyreels's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Alaska, Skwentna to Kodiak
Posts: 3,115
Send a message via Skype™ to Hardyreels
Quote:
Originally Posted by circlespey View Post
Serious question; in today's world of modern rods, etc., why are people waxing ferrules? I haven't done this in 22 years of fishing with a long rod and haven't had any issues with any of my rods that I know of. Am I missing damage that I am not seeing?
Good point. I've always thought that if your rod keeps coming loose at the joints there is something wrong. That something could be a defect although I would bet against that in most cases...… Of there is something about an anglers casting that is subjecting the rod to various angles of torque (for lack of a better phrase) If someone's rod is coming loose there is a cause.

I'm a very straight forward caster, no snake rolls now fancy loops of any sort just fishing the long rod the same way I would fish a 9' rod but with more reach and ease of casting. I began using what I later learned were called Spey casts in the 1990's with my old Orvis Light Salmon rod, all these years I've never had a rod come apart or become obviously loose. I do check the bottom joint sometimes because I don't jam my rods together. Have never waxed a rod and some I have owned and fished for 40 years and they still fit like they should.
Bob Budesa and Oregon134 like this.

Kill the hens you kill the river.
Hardyreels is offline  
post #12 of 30 (permalink) Old 10-18-2019, 04:49 PM
Registered User
 
ENSO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 378
Quote:
Originally Posted by Emel View Post
....
I found two bars of Swix X-country ski wax that has been laying around for years and was hoping it was ok to use to
wax the ferrules on my rods. Any thoughts? .....
Interesting. Have lots of xc ski wax and never thought of using it on fly rod ferrules. I bet Klister would really hold the rod together!

Suggestions:

=> Keep the ferrules clean. Isopropyl alcohol (99%) works well.

=> Similar to others, I use Loon Graffitolin. Easy to apply summer and winter. Wipes off easily. If applied sparingly as it should be, it lasts a long time.

None of the dozens upon dozens of different types of xc ski wax I have used, come close to the feel and properties of Loon Graffitolin.

Frankly, if I had to dip into the xc wax collection, I would be tempted to use a glide wax but why bother when for the price of starting up your vehicle and letting it sit idling for a while, you can easily afford a small container of Loon wax.
SimonD likes this.

°

Science is not common sense. Much of it is devoted to a systematic documentation of what we do not know and understand.
ENSO is offline  
post #13 of 30 (permalink) Old 10-18-2019, 04:58 PM
Registered User
 
Botsari's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Northern California
Posts: 2,979
I’d guess that older well-used rods, unless they got damaged in some way by grit, might be very smooth through use, and work great. I know I’m a special case - I have a couple of surgically fused joints on my right hand from an old injury and a lot of times I can’t physically close my hand enough to apply the right force. I have one Burkie single hand blank I built, and fresh from its rolling it REALLY had issues with sticking, especially in warm weather. No one could, get it apart some day before I used wax. Along the lines I suspect many people use it to help get their rods APPART at the end of a day as well. Others may have other reasons. But it’s not because people are casting incorrectly. I know Simon Gawesworth has always advocated tape on spey rods. I think it’s fantastic that lots of people have never had issue, and that the technology can work that well for so long. Unfortunately that has not been my experience.

“Gravity is a harsh mistress!”, The Tick
Botsari is offline  
post #14 of 30 (permalink) Old 10-18-2019, 07:20 PM
Registered User
 
Pere's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Nova scotia,new brunswick
Posts: 987
No one has mentioned this but I used to use the lead in a pencil. That works too. Cross country ski wax would not be good as it is sticky and you'll not be able to separate the rod pieces. Just my opinion
Pere is online now  
post #15 of 30 (permalink) Old 10-18-2019, 10:12 PM
Registered User
 
SimonD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: St.Lawrence river
Posts: 177
Having done a lot of XC-skiing and a bit of racing, and having always waxed my own skis, I know for a fact that the ski waxes contain a lot of additives. Some of which or not all that 'nice". And that rep biting off pieces of wax to show they are safe, well, Anything to up sales I guess… How will those additives react with the blank, or more specifically the resins holding the layers of carbon fiber together? Who knows… Do you want to take the risk just to save some $$ ? Up to you… I've just used some colorless and odourless candle was. And since my last order with Bob Meiser, have some ferrule wax he supplied (its probably candle wax… :0) ). I see no reason to use the ski wax, which I have tons of at home…

Just my 0.02$
ENSO likes this.

Simon D.
SimonD is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Spey Pages forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Linear Mode Linear Mode
Rate This Thread:



Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome