Kispiox access - Spey Pages
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post #1 of 73 (permalink) Old 08-25-2012, 03:44 PM Thread Starter
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Unhappy Kispiox access

I hear rumours of the Kispiox Band planing to limit access to the river from the potato patch to the Skeena by charging ridiculous fees to put in and take out on native ground($200/boat and $100/person).The guides would love this because if they pay they could have unlimited and sole access to a large piece of river.
Any thoughts?
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post #2 of 73 (permalink) Old 08-25-2012, 10:15 PM
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If the river is on their reserve then they can and should reap some benefits. Why let the white man make money off the resource while they sit by and watch ?

Wild Fish Wild Rivers
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post #3 of 73 (permalink) Old 08-25-2012, 11:04 PM
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Good move by the Kispiox Band.
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post #4 of 73 (permalink) Old 08-26-2012, 11:14 AM
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They used to require an access permit a while back.

Boss fly lines.
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FFF CI and THCI
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post #5 of 73 (permalink) Old 08-26-2012, 11:28 AM
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Let,s think about this for a moment.Driving about Hazelton,you will notce a modern school,arena,hospital,commuity center as well as roads and houseing that are either fully paid for by the BC tax payer or heavily subsidized.Charging this tax payer upwards of $300 to drift his pontoon boat on this "free flowing" BC river ,is not imo being a good neighbor.
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post #6 of 73 (permalink) Old 08-26-2012, 12:19 PM
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Sounds very akin to the Deschutes River and the Warm Springs Indian reservation. You can land/stand/fish off the BLM (think that's the ground owner) but without a permit/Native Guide their side of the river is a 'no-no.'




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post #7 of 73 (permalink) Old 08-26-2012, 12:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J.G. View Post
If the river is on their reserve then they can and should reap some benefits. Why let the white man make money off the resource while they sit by and watch ?

I'll tell you why. I'll preface by saying I am ignorant to details on how that stretch is being overseen. But I am a potential visiting tourist, so my opinion, sought by w.r. earl....should count?

So, heres my knee-jerk, likely to incite anger, economic perspective:

Unless they can show a budget and investment of tribal monies to directly help manage that fishery, they are getting all the benefit with none of the risk.
At least guides and their clients pay into the management in some way through licensing and fees to the govmt. If they get my 300, Do they get taxed/tarriffed on that?

So if I go through there and pay the fee, what do i "get" that I didn't get before?
Whats in it for me and my 300 bucks?
What do some of the proceeds do.....Do they improve the river? the fish? stabilze the banks? the experience? do they only allow a limited number of people?

I gotta tell you. Every year my dream of spending thousands of my modest middle class income to catch a BC fish and let it go is turning from headache--- to pain in the ass.

What I lack in skill --- I make up for with enthusiasm.

Last edited by speyday; 08-26-2012 at 12:54 PM.
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post #8 of 73 (permalink) Old 08-26-2012, 12:40 PM
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One mention in a rumor and the lines get drawn pretty fast. Doesn't take much to get folks jammies in bunch when your talking about steelheading in NW BC these days.
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post #9 of 73 (permalink) Old 08-26-2012, 01:04 PM
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Originally Posted by speyday View Post
Every year my dream of spending thousands of my modest middle class income to catch a BC fish and let it go is turning from headache--- to pain in the ass.



To me the whole thing is a government regulatory issue. If they charge you a fee for a license and this fee permits you to fish certain rivers and lakes, it is a government's responsibility to provide you access to same water bodies.

But the government wants you to pay your license money, then pay for all the fishing equipment you need, then they sell all land to someone else and you are expected to start paying daily access fees to property owners.

In the case of reserve lands, I believe your Canadian freshwater license should not even allow you to fish rivers on reserves. Any sport fishing permits for such rivers have to be issued by the First Nations.
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post #10 of 73 (permalink) Old 08-26-2012, 02:02 PM
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Originally Posted by speyday View Post
I'll tell you why. I'll preface by saying I am ignorant to details on how that stretch is being overseen. But I am a potential visiting tourist, so my opinion, sought by w.r. earl....should count?

So, heres my knee-jerk, likely to incite anger, economic perspective:

Unless they can show a budget and investment of tribal monies to directly help manage that fishery, they are getting all the benefit with none of the risk.
At least guides and their clients pay into the management in some way through licensing and fees to the govmt. If they get my 300, Do they get taxed/tarriffed on that?

So if I go through there and pay the fee, what do i "get" that I didn't get before?
Whats in it for me and my 300 bucks?
What do some of the proceeds do.....Do they improve the river? the fish? stabilze the banks? the experience? do they only allow a limited number of people?

I gotta tell you. Every year my dream of spending thousands of my modest middle class income to catch a BC fish and let it go is turning from headache--- to pain in the ass.
I think the key word here is "ignorant".

For information on how the First Nations manage their fisheries in the region you should contact the Gistkan Watershed Authority :
http://fnbc.info/node/952n

So you're telling me that if I open an amusment park on my land, or a boat lauch etc.... I shouldn't be able to charge for it's use without showing where the money is going ?

The Kispiox Band has every right to charge money to use facilities on their land as well as completely restricting access.

You and I have no rights / entitlement to use a boat launch that is on reserve land / private property.

This "I fish for steelhead in the Skeena watershed and therefore have the right to do as I please and have unrestricted access to all her glory, free of charge" attitude, is getting really old.

Wild Fish Wild Rivers

Last edited by J.G.; 08-26-2012 at 02:42 PM.
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post #11 of 73 (permalink) Old 08-26-2012, 03:40 PM Thread Starter
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kispiox crowding

Of course we can not cross private or reserve land without permission to get to a lake or river.But it is my understanding that if you are on a waterway anywhere in Canada the shoreline or riverbank is public up to the high water mark.Does this not apply on waterways surrounded by reserve land?
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post #12 of 73 (permalink) Old 08-26-2012, 03:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by speyday View Post
I'll tell you why. I'll preface by saying I am ignorant to details on how that stretch is being overseen. But I am a potential visiting tourist, so my opinion, sought by w.r. earl....should count?

So, heres my knee-jerk, likely to incite anger, economic perspective:

Unless they can show a budget and investment of tribal monies to directly help manage that fishery, they are getting all the benefit with none of the risk.
At least guides and their clients pay into the management in some way through licensing and fees to the govmt. If they get my 300, Do they get taxed/tarriffed on that?

So if I go through there and pay the fee, what do i "get" that I didn't get before?
Whats in it for me and my 300 bucks?
What do some of the proceeds do.....Do they improve the river? the fish? stabilze the banks? the experience? do they only allow a limited number of people?

I gotta tell you. Every year my dream of spending thousands of my modest middle class income to catch a BC fish and let it go is turning from headache--- to pain in the ass.
There is a simple solution to this problem-please feel free not to come-you ask what you get for your 300 bucks?--you get to fish a great river with great fish at likely 1/3 the cost or less of the gear you use
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post #13 of 73 (permalink) Old 08-26-2012, 06:17 PM
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Quote:
But it is my understanding that if you are on a waterway anywhere in Canada the shoreline or riverbank is public up to the high water mark.Does this not apply on waterways surrounded by reserve land?
The short answer is no...

Larry
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post #14 of 73 (permalink) Old 08-26-2012, 07:51 PM
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1) It would be $200 if you're in a boat and $100 if you want to walk in. Not $200+$100 if you have a boat.

2) JG pretty much covered why this is not a bad thing but I'll add another: if they can get some $$$ off us ethically defunct sportsfishers, maybe they're less likely to kill so many steelhead.
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post #15 of 73 (permalink) Old 08-26-2012, 08:36 PM
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1) It would be $200 if you're in a boat and $100 if you want to walk in. Not $200+$100 if you have a boat.
Is that an annual pass? If annual, it doesn't seem totally unreasonable...I could see something slightly lower having greater support (and ultimately more income), but I'm not the one making the calls.

The problem the natives are facing is that they never charged in the first place (or didn't enforce) which they probably always should have. Now everyone thinks it's free and they are entitled to access there. Don't get me wrong, I think loss of access sucks in general...but the public was never really entitled to this one anyways.

Do the natives "own" the entire streambed/water on the reservation...i.e., you can't simply float through from above/wade without a pass; or is it solely to access the boat ramps?
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