Lago Strobel, Santa Cruz, Argentina - Spey Pages
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post #1 of 37 (permalink) Old 10-19-2008, 10:09 AM Thread Starter
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Lago Strobel, Santa Cruz, Argentina

If you happen to be a do-it-yourselfer that had plans of fishing this lake this season, you may be disappointed. While not 100%, I have it on pretty good evidence that the Loop folks have succeeded in locking it up for the exclusive use of their elite clients. It had become legendary for huge Rainbows. I know of two groups of Argentines who were contacted by ranch owners saying they had leased the rights of passage through their land to the Loopers. Being a foreigner here I can only say this is a stone drag. If I was an Argentine I would be looking for some avenue to raise hell.
Cheers,
Frank
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post #2 of 37 (permalink) Old 10-19-2008, 10:26 AM
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Originally Posted by chile66 View Post
If you happen to be a do-it-yourselfer that had plans of fishing this lake this season, you may be disappointed. While not 100%, I have it on pretty good evidence that the Loop folks have succeeded in locking it up for the exclusive use of their elite clients. It had become legendary for huge Rainbows. I know of two groups of Argentines who were contacted by ranch owners saying they had leased the rights of passage through their land to the Loopers. Being a foreigner here I can only say this is a stone drag. If I was an Argentine I would be looking for some avenue to raise hell.
Cheers,
Frank
Same as almost the entire length of the Rio Grande then. Perhaps you should drop a line to the Loop folks - I'd be interested to read their response.

This raises an interesting issue - I'm going down South for a week on the Rio Grande early next year but I'd be lying if I didn't say that I have some misgivings about the fact that my presence is keeping locals off the water. It'll be my second visit to that legendary river but it may well be my last for that reason.
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post #3 of 37 (permalink) Old 10-19-2008, 06:16 PM
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is this a change from the previous few years? i thought their camp was just on the one end where the feeder stream is? do they have the rights to the whole lake now? i have a do it yourself trip planned departing in a few weeks and am very interested in any developments to this?

-zack
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post #4 of 37 (permalink) Old 10-20-2008, 08:44 AM Thread Starter
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Attack

I can't say for sure. I'm still in the Bariloche area but will be heading south soon. The info I got here was that they'd leased all the entrance rights. I'll pursue this some more and let you know what I find out. I hope I'm wrong. For me, there's plenty of fishing. It's more a matter of principle.
Cheers,
Frank
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post #5 of 37 (permalink) Old 10-20-2008, 02:58 PM
 
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Post loop are thiefs

hey I was readying about strobel lake and iīll let you know:
first ..all the rights of water (rivers, lakes etc.)belong to the state of argentina,ef you go fishing there... they canīt stop you to go,that isnīt legal (you can even sue them)they can charge you for a guide(if you need one), they canīt even stop you to cross their land ,there is an other low that said :that the population of argetina have all the rigths to practice any action over nationals waters(with out comercial end)no one can carge you a price for fishing , because you have a fishing licence that alow you fising all over the cuntry.
what loops itīs been doing is ilegal, they thing that they are doing good doing that ,thats itīs rowng!!t they are just thiefs lying to the people saing that that lake belong to them, why donīt they go to ..... and try to get some fish there.
rio grande have the same problem ,but corruption fix everything!!and they just look for money not for the pleasure of fly fishing.
they are not doing any good charging the p anglers for cach and realese!
loop great company ,my .... .
nothing else to say!!
sergio
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post #6 of 37 (permalink) Old 10-21-2008, 02:55 PM
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Hi, I was in Strobel in march of 2008. I was also thinking how to do it "yourself". But everybody (i mean about local flyfishermen) even who weree not doing bizz on that, said me that i should not do it. It also can be because strobel was something new to local flyfishermen.

so i contacted the land owner north of stobel and for 150usd/day i had a sheter an three time a food per day and wine + transportation from rute 40 down to the lake. So it was quite a good deal.

But if Sergio says truth and everybody is alowed to cross the private land and if you have enought time , then try to do it yourself. I would go for it. so check the law and go forward if law allows.

cheers

Roolis
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post #7 of 37 (permalink) Old 10-22-2008, 08:11 AM
 
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Originally Posted by chile66 View Post
If you happen to be a do-it-yourselfer that had plans of fishing this lake this season, you may be disappointed. While not 100%, I have it on pretty good evidence that the Loop folks have succeeded in locking it up for the exclusive use of their elite clients. It had become legendary for huge Rainbows. I know of two groups of Argentines who were contacted by ranch owners saying they had leased the rights of passage through their land to the Loopers. Being a foreigner here I can only say this is a stone drag. If I was an Argentine I would be looking for some avenue to raise hell.
Cheers,
Frank
I think you got it a bit wrong. Loop is leasing the rights to use private land and the private owned water for tourism. Loop found this lake 4-5 years ago, at that stage noone (or maybe just some few that fly in with helicopter and was private friends with the landowner) was fishing there. We renamed the lake Lago Strobel to Jurassic Lake as a nickname. The plan was also to build a "back packers camp" at very low price but we had to cancel that since we got no bookings for it. To get there is quite risky, theres no roads and easy to get stucked in the mud, and its in the middle of nowhere.
My question - is it possible to pass private land and fish in private waters in USA?
I hope we will be able next season to build something at very low cost, Loop is not a company that try to keep people out. The first thing we did in Rio Gallegos was opening up a part of our, also private, waters to public at no cost. If you, or anyone else, wants to know more FACTS just send me an email. PS This is first time I say something on this pages and will try to avoid that also in future since I feel this forums is not meant for me as tackle manufacturer and adventure organiser.
Christer Sjöberg, Loop, Sweden
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post #8 of 37 (permalink) Old 10-22-2008, 08:24 AM
 
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Originally Posted by sergio View Post
hey I was readying about strobel lake and iīll let you know:
first ..all the rights of water (rivers, lakes etc.)belong to the state of argentina,ef you go fishing there... they canīt stop you to go,that isnīt legal (you can even sue them)they can charge you for a guide(if you need one), they canīt even stop you to cross their land ,there is an other low that said :that the population of argetina have all the rigths to practice any action over nationals waters(with out comercial end)no one can carge you a price for fishing , because you have a fishing licence that alow you fising all over the cuntry.
what loops itīs been doing is ilegal, they thing that they are doing good doing that ,thats itīs rowng!!t they are just thiefs lying to the people saing that that lake belong to them, why donīt they go to ..... and try to get some fish there.
rio grande have the same problem ,but corruption fix everything!!and they just look for money not for the pleasure of fly fishing.
they are not doing any good charging the p anglers for cach and realese!
loop great company ,my .... .
nothing else to say!!
sergio
What are you complainting about? We are leasing the rights, legally, form the landowner and have built a camp with full service there for tourism. Same has now happened on Laguna Verde and opposit side of the lake. We have nothing to do with that. Why dont you spit on them instead of Loop that found the lake, or at least, made it famous. Who heard about this lake before? Who was there fishing? We bring hundreds of turists to Argentina each season, we do a lot of promotion for your country so why are you so negative? We are also the only company that opened up a section of Gallegos, private land, with a road and parking place for locals to fish Gallegos. We have been fighting poching and killing fish in Gallegos, we have spent big money into that. We have 13 local people that gets good salary. I think you got it all backwards, I started this company Loop 30 years ago since I am burning for flyfishing, thats my life, and probably yours as well. Loop spends proudly a lot of money each year for conservation - how much do you spend? I think you should calm down a bit and stop accusing without having facts.
Reg Christer Sjöberg, Loop Sweden
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post #9 of 37 (permalink) Old 10-22-2008, 09:16 AM Thread Starter
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Loop response

Thanks Christer for your response. My source has always been reliable. Perhaps he was alarmist in this case, and I too by extension. I am trying to confirm further what I was told. If you say that it is still possible to reach the lake by only dealing directly with a landowner, then I accept this. If so, then I apologize for not being 100% certain before sounding off.
I have sent you a PM regarding more "facts."
Cheers,
Frank
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post #10 of 37 (permalink) Old 10-22-2008, 12:22 PM
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ownership -> lease

Quote:
Originally Posted by chile66 View Post
Perhaps he was alarmist in this case, and I too by extension. I am trying to confirm further what I was told. If you say that it is still possible to reach the lake by only dealing directly with a landowner, then I accept this.
I find the objection by yourself and inferrance Argentinian's should be raising hell confusing? Is law quite different in Patagonia? Ownership exists, rights for access leased to Loop. Owner never had to agree in first place/talk to them. So new access arranged thru Loop I'd assume? If not then what would be the point of Loop completing it's arrangement and making it's investment? Just sound business to protect your investment by minimizing risk. Christen even offered up "I hope we will be able next season to build something at very low cost, Loop is not a company that try to keep people out. "

I could be missing a lot, but ownership and rights seem clear. It's a bonus Loops open to helping provide some access etc I would think??

They seem environmentally aware and their investment and forward thinking to promote the sport I'm thankful for. I think we all benefit in some indirect manner at minimum.

FWIW, I don't own any loop products at present so no other agenda etc.
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post #11 of 37 (permalink) Old 10-22-2008, 02:25 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Roolis View Post
Hi, I was in Strobel in march of 2008. I was also thinking how to do it "yourself". But everybody (i mean about local flyfishermen) even who weree not doing bizz on that, said me that i should not do it. It also can be because strobel was something new to local flyfishermen.

so i contacted the land owner north of stobel and for 150usd/day i had a sheter an three time a food per day and wine + transportation from rute 40 down to the lake. So it was quite a good deal.

But if Sergio says truth and everybody is alowed to cross the private land and if you have enought time , then try to do it yourself. I would go for it. so check the law and go forward if law allows.

cheers

Roolis
Question - how was the fishing on that side. I have mainly fished the outlet from the stream where we have our base camp so I am curious.
Reg
Christer
Christ
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post #12 of 37 (permalink) Old 10-23-2008, 08:39 AM
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Christer,hi,

fishing was fabulous. I am 100% sure fishing is superb all around this lake. The problem can be only western winds. But But at North they have couple of Peninsulas where you always find a shelter. I mean does not mater what wind- you always find a shelter to fish and not for a one person.

rgds

Roolis
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post #13 of 37 (permalink) Old 10-26-2008, 08:04 PM
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i know lago strobel because i was living in puerto madryn from the 86 to 91 and i star learnig fly fishing then (my friends father was my teacher)and that guy was fishing in strobel at this time,that lake was famous in argentina, loop didn't made it famous,maybe the people from other cuntrys didn't heard about it,Im no spiting on loop , but i'm no happy with what is happenig,"openig privates waters"there are none private waters in argentina, like i have said"waters belonge to the goverment"and you can pass over any land with no problem and if you are giving job to 10 guys , good for them!! the laws in patagonia are the same than Bs As and ,there were some paths to go to that lake, in patagonia you have more freedom!!.
I was fishing in that lake on march 99!! itīs was really good and we were camping close to the lake !!we let the owner know that we were fishing and then we said bay!!
but tell me something when you said"We are leasing the rights, legally, form the landowner" he has to have a deal with the you about the land not about the river and lake.
i never mean to made you mad , but here you have a link , is in english and spanish , read it please and then let me know if Iīm wrong:
http://www.aapm.org.ar/avisos%20inde...amento0809.pdf
then here you have the laws from chubut :
really help full ef you read spanish other wise you can use:
http://babelfish.yahoo.com/translate_txt to translate .
over the last link read really well the art:
TITULO V - De los planes de manejo pesqueros en cuencas hidrográficas .

TITULO VI - De los pasos y accesos.
and Iīm still looking for the same in english.
but i think that the last link is a bit dificult to read!!
even in spanish!!
so dont get mad at me because a said the truth!!!
but if you are going to be guiding there i m may see you guys!!
im planing to get there for some argentinia stellhead!!

Last edited by sergiolax; 10-26-2008 at 08:07 PM. Reason: fixing speling
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post #14 of 37 (permalink) Old 11-05-2008, 08:03 AM Thread Starter
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Public Water in Argentina

is spelled out in this translation by the Reglamento de Pesca Deportiva Continental Patagonico. According to the Civil Code of the Argentine Republic: Article 2340 "Public property includes...3. Rivers and river beds, other natural watercourses and all waters that have or might become suitable for general public use...4. ...inland riverbanks which include the range of the floodplain...5. Navigable lakes and their lakebeds. Article 2341 "Private persons have the right to use and enjoy public property belonging to the state or states..."
Having said that, the Constitution guarantees private property rights. So apparently access depends on the good graces of the landowner. Many grant passage and many hide behind a fear for their animals or some such construction.
I must comment on Loop's assertion that they " discovered" Lago Strobel. Argentine guides have been taking their clients there long before Loop arrived. Loop discovered it in the same sense that Columbus discovered the Americas. He did, for the Europeans, but us indians have always been here.
Lago Strobel and the Rio Gallegos are in the province of Santa Cruz. Complaints, accusations and suggestions may be made (in Spanish [there are free translation sites]) via e-mail: [email protected]

Saludos y buena pesca,
Fco.
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post #15 of 37 (permalink) Old 11-20-2008, 03:29 PM Thread Starter
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Hurry if you want to fish Strobel (or Jurrassic if you prefer)

The latest news I have on good authority. A wealthy Argentine has purchased one of the three estancias surrounding the lake. His representative is now, or will shortly be, in the States and/or Europe flogging building sites.
All of a sudden a single lodge doesn't sound so bad!
Cheers,
Fco.
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