the "Non-Twist Knot" - Spey Pages
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post #1 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-22-2020, 06:48 AM Thread Starter
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the "Non-Twist Knot"

So last season, a friend of mine (Mark S) introduced me to a knot called the "Non-Twist Knot". He forwarded me the link from the Deschutes Angler that gave instructions on the knot. It's used for large trout flies that tend to spin when casting or when stripping line in : thus causing twist in the leader.

The whole thought is the tippet freely spins inside the hook eye preventing line twist. The video from the Deschutes Angler will show how you cut off a short piece of 10lb mono and tie it in with a triple surgeons knot into your tippet.

I tried this knot out last season on steelhead dry flies. I dig it. I really prefer downeye hooks on my steelhead dryflies and this knot works great - as it allows the tippet to exit perpendicular to the shank.



As far as the "non twist" idea; maybe it helps a little but what I really like about this knot is that you don't trap hackle/hair fibers when cinching it down! (I really dislike trapping material in the knot....especially when it's really well-tied Steelhead Bee).

So, the question is: Would I trust it?

It's landed hot larger steelhead for me last year and the knot has been solid.

Click on the video below for a "hack" on the Non-Twist Knot:



As you can see in the video: If I am not too concerned about losing tippet length, I just double over my 10lb Maxima tippet (I think our own Mae West gave me that idea). I also only use a Double Surgeon's knot since my dryfly hook eyes are small.

Would love to here some reviews on how the knot performs for some of you this coming season.

Cheers and Blessings,
Adrian

P.S. I normally don't talk fast but I was running out of room on phone storage for that video

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post #2 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-22-2020, 11:56 AM
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Really cool idea, eliminates the need for swivels elsewhere in the leader or line. Any specific reason you run the line through the underside of the eye? Almost seems counter-intuitive to add an extra point of twist in the setup, although it seems to work fine for ya.
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post #3 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-22-2020, 04:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unch View Post
Really cool idea, eliminates the need for swivels elsewhere in the leader or line. Any specific reason you run the line through the underside of the eye? Almost seems counter-intuitive to add an extra point of twist in the setup, although it seems to work fine for ya.
Up through the down eye achieves the same effect as a riffle hitch, keeps the fly on the surface
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post #4 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-22-2020, 08:53 PM
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Thanks for posting the info on this knot. I will have to give this a try for sure.
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post #5 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-22-2020, 10:54 PM
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Maybe I'm not fully understanding this knot but I think I am. It's not tied to fly, it stops the fly from falling of the end of the tippet. Ingenious, this is 2020 and fly fishing is just now seeing the brilliance of this...can't believe I didn't think of it. I've lost too many steelhead because the at fly knot broke because of tension applied at squeezing junctions. I think that's why every fly I've lost to a steelhead was lost to the steelhead. Any knot at the tippet end that stops the fly from slipping off will not receive the cutting tension due to the location of the knot. The entire knot receives the tension so it transfers it everywhere within the knot. I'll be using this approach for all my swung line fishing from here on out.

Thanks for the post!
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Last edited by klickrolf; 05-24-2020 at 11:29 PM.
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post #6 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-23-2020, 12:58 AM
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I also recall seeing that video from Amy but have since forgotten it. Definitely has applications for dry flies, both drifted and swung.

Mark
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post #7 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-23-2020, 12:59 AM
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Great knot. Good idea. The only thing is that you cannot tie all sizes of flies on all sizes of tippet. You need to make sure the tippet knot will never go through the eye even on huge tension. Which is not easy to guess... My 2 cents here. Be careful with this cuz a knot under its first high tension can get smaller. And since dry fly fishing is often better on light tippets, it is even more important to keep that in mind.
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post #8 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-23-2020, 02:55 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unch View Post
Really cool idea, eliminates the need for swivels elsewhere in the leader or line. Any specific reason you run the line through the underside of the eye? Almost seems counter-intuitive to add an extra point of twist in the setup, although it seems to work fine for ya.
As Upstateonthefly mentioned, it helps plane the fly to the surface - just like a riffle-hitch.

Quote:
Originally Posted by klickrolf View Post
Maybe I'm not fully understanding this knot but I think I am. It's not tied to fly, it stops the fly from falling of the end of the tippet. Ingenious, this is 2020 and fly fishing is just know seeing the brilliance of this...can't believe I didn't think of it. I've lost too many steelhead because the at fly knot broke because of tension applied at squeezing junctions. I think that's why every fly I've lost to a steelhead was lost to the steelhead. Any knot at the tippet end that stops the fly from slipping off will not receive the cutting tension due to the location of the knot. The entire knot receives the tension so it transfers it everywhere within the knot. I'll be using this approach for all my swung line fishing from here on out.

Thanks for the post!
You got the right idea, Klick. Just be cautious on the size of the hookeye in relation to the size of the knot - more so with the larger wetfly hooks.

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Originally Posted by Saumon76 View Post
Great knot. Good idea. The only thing is that you cannot tie all sizes of flies on all sizes of tippet. You need to make sure the tippet knot will never go through the eye even on huge tension. Which is not easy to guess... My 2 cents here. Be careful with this cuz a knot under its first high tension can get smaller. And since dry fly fishing is often better on light tippets, it is even more important to keep that in mind.
Yeah, one definitely needs to be sure of the hookeye and size of the knot. I only fish this knot on my dryfly hooks (which tend to be on the small sizes) and the hookeyes are small. I just use a double surgeons knot for my sz 6 hooks (which is usually my largest dryfly hook) but a larger hook size may need a triple surgeons knot.

Cheers, All. Would be fun to hold a review of this knot later in the season after a few trials. I have tried it on trout this spring with the big salmonflies and the knot is a no-brainer. But the quarry is just trout.

Adrian
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post #9 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-24-2020, 11:47 PM
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I'll be using this method for all my fly fishing, except maybe shad on the Columbia, but bluegills, perch, bass, pikeminns etc. will see a looser fly on my tippet. My wet flies and sinktip offerings will all be attached with this technique. I'll get more movement, more dead drift type action. And I'm certain I'll have fewer breakoffs. The last two serious steelhead I've hooked both broke 12# maxima clear, so I went to 15#...now I'll go back to 10#, or maybe 8... and tie a larger knot.
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post #10 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-29-2020, 05:35 PM
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Worked great

After reading about the non twist knot here, I decided to try it last night with a Stone fly/Salmon fly pattern. Worked great and was strong.
To make the knot big enough I had to triple over my line which used a considerable amount of tipped compared to a standard fishing knot. But no twisting issues when throwing big bushy dries.

SL2
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post #11 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-29-2020, 06:29 PM
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How do you hitch it??

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post #12 of 15 (permalink) Old 06-01-2020, 05:47 AM Thread Starter
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How do you hitch it??

Dan
Dan, on a downeye hook there is really no need to hitch it since the orientation of the tippet "exiting" the hookeye is comparable to hitching a fly.

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post #13 of 15 (permalink) Old 06-01-2020, 11:23 AM
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Dan, on a downeye hook there is really no need to hitch it since the orientation of the tippet "exiting" the hookeye is comparable to hitching a fly.
I was kidding. Thanks though.

Dan
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post #14 of 15 (permalink) Old 06-10-2020, 12:59 PM
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I have been using this knot for the last few trips on all of my dry fly rigs. With 2x-3x a double surgeons is perfect, if going lighter I use a triple surgeons. Ran into this one yesterday on the 3wt trout spey and this knot.
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post #15 of 15 (permalink) Old 06-18-2020, 02:32 AM
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I've been using free sliding flies above a stopper knot for almost a decade, but only for trout. I think it works great, and I've never had a fish pull the knot through the hook eye of break the knot.
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