Casting effort - Spey Pages
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post #1 of 25 (permalink) Old 02-10-2020, 04:49 PM Thread Starter
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Casting effort

Food for thought. I have gotten to the point that I can throw these lines as far as most people. However, I have also noted that really good casters can throw them with about 1/4 of the effort. It is hard to resist the temptation to muscle these casts. I know, because I am guilty! However, if you are planning on doing a lot of this for a lot of years, the power approach is going to take its toll on your joints. It is worth contemplating. The lift, the anchor placement, the sweep, and the timing of the forward cast all work together, and when they do it is not hard to get the distance you need. Thought for the day after watching some very good casters for a week in Tierra del Fuego.
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post #2 of 25 (permalink) Old 02-10-2020, 06:08 PM
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Over the years, I came to notice the same thing: I found, the harder I tried, the harder it was. I finally learned to back the power off, and let the rod do the work, concentrating on anchor placement, alignment and timing. The casts started to fly, with minimal effort.
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post #3 of 25 (permalink) Old 02-10-2020, 07:18 PM
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Keeping tension in all parts of the cast in particular the lift make for a effortless cast.
Simple to say hard to do that’s what makes it fun

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post #4 of 25 (permalink) Old 02-10-2020, 08:02 PM
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I consider myself a reasonable caster but nowhere as good as Bruce just based on his past videos. However, I find, as mentioned, if you try and muscle it you will fail, eventually. When this happening to me I usually do a couple of things. First I will shorten up a bit and try and relax. If I still can't seem to put it together I just stop. Reel up. Smoke a cigar, eat a sandwich. Whatever it takes to reset. Just walk away for 15 minutes. When you come back start short and work your way out and get back in the game. I have had a couple times, late in a long day, where it was all going wrong. I packed up, went home and hit it again the next time. It only gets better with time.

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post #5 of 25 (permalink) Old 02-10-2020, 08:31 PM
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Yep! 100% right! The harder the leash pulls on the dog, the harder the dog pulls on the leash!

My better casting days seem to happen when I'm trying the least... My bad casting days I go home sore from trying too hard to have a good casting day.
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post #6 of 25 (permalink) Old 02-12-2020, 01:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Outerhebrides View Post
Food for thought. I have gotten to the point that I can throw these lines as far as most people. However, I have also noted that really good casters can throw them with about 1/4 of the effort. It is hard to resist the temptation to muscle these casts. I know, because I am guilty! However, if you are planning on doing a lot of this for a lot of years, the power approach is going to take its toll on your joints. It is worth contemplating. The lift, the anchor placement, the sweep, and the timing of the forward cast all work together, and when they do it is not hard to get the distance you need. Thought for the day after watching some very good casters for a week in Tierra del Fuego.
No, forming a climbing loop doesn't take much effort, but... effort is proportional. Im convinced it take less "umph" than forming tight, narrow loops and generally speaking - heavier outfits (weight-class) require more effort than lighter outfits.

I have not been to Argentina. What is it like there? Maybe you can give some detail on weather conditions and of the riggings used there. 8/9/10 weight? I can say - surface presentations amidst white-caps don't make much sense and it is just not worth the effort when the wind threatens to blow you off your feet!

Heavier, more powerful tapers do help. For example: A Delta Long 7/8 ( 60 feet 570 grain) versus a WA 55 (600 grain and only 55 feet to the back taper.) I've gotten used to the Airflo in winds to ~15knots. Ive been out in winds 15 knots +; however, I switch to Nextcast Winter Authority when the winds kick-up that way.

Vic.
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post #7 of 25 (permalink) Old 02-12-2020, 06:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fish0n4evr View Post
No, forming a climbing loop doesn't take much effort, but... effort is proportional. Im convinced it take less "umph" than forming tight, narrow loops and generally speaking -
Vic.
line goes where rod tip goes. more overhang will really tighten up a loop. and tests your ability to keep tension in cast.
guess what loop had more overhang?
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post #8 of 25 (permalink) Old 02-12-2020, 08:09 PM Thread Starter
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great picture! Thank you.

If everybody used shoe horns, they'd catch 'em all on shoe horns.
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post #9 of 25 (permalink) Old 02-12-2020, 11:37 PM
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Originally Posted by voodoofly View Post
more overhang will really tighten up a loop
Thanks Gary. That will help me get to where I want, I'm sure.
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post #10 of 25 (permalink) Old 02-13-2020, 08:04 AM
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Hi Everypne,

Something critical that has not been mentioned yet - rotation. I would say body rotation (torque) helps to generate speed thus increasing efficiency of the cast. Casting is about line speed and not power used. Proper use of levers (bottom hand, upper hand) combined with body rotation coupled with body weight shifting works wonders.
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post #11 of 25 (permalink) Old 02-13-2020, 10:02 AM
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Hi Everypne,

Something critical that has not been mentioned yet - rotation. I would say body rotation (torque) helps to generate speed thus increasing efficiency of the cast. Casting is about line speed and not power used. Proper use of levers (bottom hand, upper hand) combined with body rotation coupled with body weight shifting works wonders.
When using too much power what usually happens is that it's not how much power is applied it is when it is applied. As noted above body rotation helps to begin the loading/bending of the rod at the stronger butt sections so that as momentum is developed in the line for the arc of rod rotation for line speed, the power of the stronger section of the rod is utilized.

When one tries to "hit it hard" the rod rotation usually begins immediately for the forward cast and the weaker tip sections of the rod are utilized defeating the use of power application. Start bending the rod first to begin moving the line before rotating the rod for line speed.

Just a suggestion......
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post #12 of 25 (permalink) Old 02-13-2020, 10:32 AM
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Go get yourself a old slower action heavy rod and start casting with that. A rod like this will force you to slow down and cast more effectively. The harder you push it the less it works and the more tired you will become.After beating yourself up a few times casting a rod like this you will learn to cast more efficiently.
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post #13 of 25 (permalink) Old 02-13-2020, 11:09 AM
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Just to add: the line and the spey rod must match. If the head is too long or too light for the rod it will take more energy to make a decent cast.

Randy
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post #14 of 25 (permalink) Old 02-13-2020, 01:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by voodoofly View Post
line goes where rod tip goes. more overhang will really tighten up a loop. and tests your ability to keep tension in cast.
guess what loop had more overhang?
On casting effort -
Back tapers provide a fluid transition between level running section and the belly of a fly line. "Overhang"... some length of level running line beyond tiptop - creates a hinge point.
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post #15 of 25 (permalink) Old 02-13-2020, 01:37 PM
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on casting effort -
too many heavy thinkers with way too complicated explanations.
you must learn to walk before you can run.

line goes where rod tip goes.
slack is the enemy.
180 degree rule applies.

that's all i'm going to say.

peace

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