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Old 04-23-2018, 07:51 PM Thread Starter
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Question OPST commando head question

Hi guys,

Soon enough the stripers season will start and I am still trying to figure out a decent setup to help fight the wind when casting from the beach.

Currently I have a 15 ft #10/11 sage one connectcore 0.042 shooting line+rio skagit max 750 gr. and also a cheapo brand #7/8 one hander with a cheapo DT line (which is absolutely abyssmal in wind and is driving me nuts ).

My goal would be to retain my mental health by replacing that DT line on that 1 hander with a one handed spey-type setup : I would think of a 275 gr. commando head here. I would like to use the same shooting line for both rods but I am wondering if a 275gr head will properly haul a 0.042 shooting line?

Also, would a 10 ft T8 sink tip would be ok for that setup or would it be too heavy (keeping in mind that I will throw clousers)?

Thanks for your ideas!

Regards,

Lamj

Last edited by lamj; 04-25-2018 at 01:39 PM.
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Old 04-23-2018, 11:29 PM
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Opst

I can't answer all your questions but maybe one. I fish a 225 grain OPST on a 11' 4/5 switch. I primarily use this set up for throwing weighted sculpins. This set up easily casts 10' of t-11 and a 2 1/2 to 3" sculpin with medium size dumbbell eyes. Not sure how much weight are on your clousers? But a 275 grain head should easily handle 10' of t-8.

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Old 04-23-2018, 11:49 PM
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The OPST chart on their website calls for the 300 grain head to throw 10 ft sinktips. If your "cheapo" 7/8 wt is a fast action stick it may handle the 300 just fine and let you throw heavier flies as well. Check out the OPST website and email them your questions, or call them. I have found them very helpful in my direct approaches.
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Old 04-23-2018, 11:55 PM
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I fish a 200 grain Commando on a 9' 5wt with 10' T8 and it casts like magic.

I fish it off deep riff raff for smallmouth and it gets deep real fast.
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Old 04-24-2018, 12:10 AM
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I use a 300 gr commando with my Winston 7 wt. 10 IIBX and it will launch a tonne of line doing a snap T or single spey. I would go with the 300 gr. With the set uop that you described.
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Old 04-24-2018, 04:09 AM
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That shooting line diameter is about the same what an average WF8 line has or even thinner so it is fine.

I see that your planned line head comes too short and difficult to overhead cast. Also 355gr seems too heavy for a #7/8 single hand rod. Shorter than 30ft head limits distance more than can be gained back making it heavier. When the line head is short the line loop runs thru head fast and cast comes short.

I would change the DT to a shooting head which is good taper for SW fishing. You can make two using both ends and depending its weight there might come a length of level from the middle. You might aleady have an idea what length you like out of rod tip but the DT line which is inside rod also is felt and bends the rod so cut it first two feet longer. Spool some nylon to reel and nail knot the cut DT thick end and test cast using so much overhang that head does not come inside rod when you haul. Lawn cast so you can pull whole head to back cast and use soft yarn as a test fly.

If it feels too heavy shorten 6 inches and test cast again and repeat until it feels nice. Then strip one inch of coating away and thead wrap a loop and it is so small that it runs OK inside rod guides and after fishing closer is no issue to false cast line head out again.

When you fish you might think the head came too light and you can make other end just right.

Esa
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Old 04-24-2018, 07:32 AM
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I would factor in the prevailing winds where you fish to the good advice so far. On the beach you might well be doing more OH casting than skagit. In that case a heavier end shooting head Intermediate might give an advantage dealing with on shore blows. Bulkier running lines will also limit your distance/reach 30-35 lb Lazar line should give you enough grip w/o losing too much.

The real solution is digging deep for a modern SW ready swtich rod in that range with the guts to slam out a shooting head and handle stripers' long runs.

Good luck and let us know how it works out.

ddb
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Old 04-24-2018, 11:34 AM Thread Starter
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Question

Thanks for your replies! I appreciate it very much!

I would not go for a 300 gr head as the rod is really soft, acts as an overcooked spaghetti when trying to throw that 8 wt DT line. I think a 300 gr + weight of the tip + clouser would be too much, really.

Esa, I like your idea of cutting my DT line (in half?) so it would make two heads. Regarding your way of tying it to a mono running line, would you really tie the thick end of the DT taper to the running line (that would make it more of a scandi setup no?)? I thought I'd get more distance tying it the other way around (ie: thin end to running line)? Then is there any rule or formula to get a sink tip that would be right for that custom cut head (or would you just go with a poly leader since the thick part of the head would be attached to the running line)?

DDB, gotcha on that, I absolutely agree with you that a switch rod would be the way to go but unfortunately, funds are not there at the moment(don't want to buy oversees stuff) and one more rod would also be a divorce case here, you know what it is

Regards,

Lamj

Last edited by lamj; 04-25-2018 at 01:38 PM. Reason: added info
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Old 04-26-2018, 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted by lamj View Post
I would not go for a 300 gr head as the rod is really soft, acts as an overcooked spaghetti when trying to throw that 8 wt DT line. I think a 300 gr + weight of the tip + clouser would be too much, really.

Esa, I like your idea of cutting my DT line (in half?) so it would make two heads. Regarding your way of tying it to a mono running line, would you really tie the thick end of the DT taper to the running line (that would make it more of a scandi setup no?)? I thought I'd get more distance tying it the other way around (ie: thin end to running line)? Then is there any rule or formula to get a sink tip that would be right for that custom cut head (or would you just go with a poly leader since the thick part of the head would be attached to the running line)?
I am sorry I missed this post!

If your DT8 is standard its first 30ft weights 210gr and following level line about 7.5gr/ft but because fly lines can have big tolerances you should weight it to be sure. I cast about 225gr shooting heads using #7 single hand rods and about 260gr heads using #8 SH rods which are rated about right. Every fly angler should have a scale because knowing what line weight we cast is good to know but also flyes weight at least for me after boxes get messed up after a while.

Front taper is important for Spey casting but it is almost as important for overhead casting because it slows down line loop run but leader and even fly calms down line loop and line tip does not overshoot too much. It is common that when overhead casting we hear interesting "bang-sound" it is a sign that fly is lost and leader tip speed exceeds speed of sound when false casting and other way casting stroke is began before line hasnot straightened. If flyes are lost and the reason is not the wegetation it can be because casting is too rushed and leader breaks when fly first accelerates and then line tries to jerk it back but can't

I like about 10ft front taper for overhead casting and good DT lines have that long tapers both ends and some have even 15ft tapers but there are DTs which have only 5ft tapers and line tip diameter does not get small either. When fly has lots of wind resistance the leader could be shortened and also shorter front taper line can be better and these improve whe casting to strong head wind.

Overhead shooting head does not need a rear taper but thick line end which is looped can be nasty inside rod when double hauling but most current rods have big enough guides and getting line head out should not need too powerful hauling.

It seems like lines which have longer front tapers and which rears are heavier but not as much heavier than Spey lines are do increase casting distance and it might be because then line loop air drag which is relatively higher on fly leg slows down the line loop run speed and then flight time increase. But this is for distance casting where no fly is used but just a small piece of yarn.

There are no exact formulas how to match tips to bellys but the line loop improves when the front end of a belly is very close the tip rear end weight. You can make other end of your DT a shorter shooting head which you put thin end towards the shooting line and put tip to blunt end. If the tip is tapered as well the head casts smoothly and you can cast it easier some of it inside rod and it still shoots very well because rear is already thin but you might find it easier to cast using also longer overhang which has positive effect to casting distance.

Esa
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