Political threads - Page 2 - Spey Pages
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post #16 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-22-2017, 06:41 PM Thread Starter
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I'm of the opinion that politics has no niche on a spey fishing forum.
Jon,
I doubt that anyone would disagree with you there. Judging from some of the responses, perhaps it wasn't clear what I was referring too. I do appreciate that the moderators have put a stop to threads, both recently and in the past that got into political pissing matches and far off the topic of things related to spey fishing. My point was that since certain discussions are being allowed (currently) which do tend to dip into somewhat loaded issues regarding environmental concerns (very much related to fishing); perhaps they might be less intrusive to the forum if they were removed from the "General" forum.

Because those topics often do cross the line a bit, or at least come a bit too close to it, I would suspect that it could become more of a problem. I just that perhaps they would be less obtrusive and bothersome if moved to a different forum. I would personally like to see some of these discussions still take place, within the rules addressed already; the suggestion was a thought towards making them less "clutter" to those who might not want to see any threads relating to environmental/conservation/habitat/regulatory issues.
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post #17 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-22-2017, 06:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RLG View Post
I vote no politics.
Can't we get in enough fights without Politics? Flossing comes to mind

Carl Blackledge
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post #18 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-22-2017, 06:53 PM
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it has been stared on numerous occasions that it isn't so much political as environmental. I am all for having a voice over impacts to what we as fishermen and I would hope environmentalists value most - I think this community could have a positive impact on what happens on this front
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post #19 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-22-2017, 07:20 PM
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Quote:
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it has been stared on numerous occasions that it isn't so much political as environmental. I am all for having a voice over impacts to what we as fishermen and I would hope environmentalists value most - I think this community could have a positive impact on what happens on this front
Yes, agree 100%. It's not even that we need to all agree and act as a single body (though that would be amazing), but maybe a conversation had or an opinion piece read on this forum might galvanize some individual of us to stand up and take action on something they personally believe in, in a way they haven't done before.

I'd also argue that there's a distinction between political and partisan. We're not going to be able to have substantial discussions about environmental concerns without being political - they're inherently political topics. But I do think we can have those conversations without being partisan.

And, yes, it's true that we do just fine arguing about things without politics involved. For me, I find the arguments relating to environmental policy more worthwhile than those relating to flossing, or (even worse!) the inferiority of skagit heads to long bellys...
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post #20 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-22-2017, 08:10 PM
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I don't think that topics which might introduce CONTROVERSY and DISCUSSION, sometimes heated, and possible ARGUMENTS should be censored or removed. Environmental topics, ethics topics, opinions - those are all fair game in my opinion, but those topics do not fall under POLITICS. Maybe my definition of 'politics' is entirely different than yours, but the subject just seems like an easy opportunity to troll people. And political 'discussions' never end pretty.
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post #21 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-22-2017, 08:31 PM
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There are rules cleary posted that govern these pages. Its easy to have a heated argument among passionate people, but the rules are there to avoid it getting out of hand. We have a choice to engage or not, but we should be aware of the consequences.

I feel there is room for debate, but I'll leave it at and respect the moderators choices when it's time to shut it down.
We're lucky enough to have this great place and the people who take the time to keep it great.
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post #22 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-22-2017, 11:58 PM
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If I was to say, nymphing with a two handed rod is not fly fishing, would that be too political. I am just kidding of course. I have visited Speypages almost everyday dating back to when I joined. I can't recall every turning off my computer in anger after a visit. Not even when Dana sold out. I have watched a few people leave in anger, but for the most part it has always been a positive experience for me. I have a strong dislike for talking politics with any of my friends that may not share my same views. A non combative debate about what tippet is the best or what material is best, is OK, but when it become personal it not all the good. Posting information, such as the the vote on Gil netting the Columbia, though it might be political can be done right and in a positive way. But there is always two sides to an issue and care must be taken when posting a response. I feel the moderators do one heck of a job keeping us in line. Hat off to them and to this community for making this place a joy to be a part of.
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post #23 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-23-2017, 12:27 AM
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If I was to say, nymphing with a two handed rod is not fly fishing, would that be too political. I am just kidding of course. I have visited Speypages almost everyday dating back to when I joined. I can't recall every turning off my computer in anger after a visit. Not even when Dana sold out. I have watched a few people leave in anger, but for the most part it has always been a positive experience for me. I have a strong dislike for talking politics with any of my friends that may not share my same views. A non combative debate about what tippet is the best or what material is best, is OK, but when it become personal it not all the good. Posting information, such as the the vote on Gil netting the Columbia, though it might be political can be done right and in a positive way. But there is always two sides to an issue and care must be taken when posting a response. I feel the moderators do one heck of a job keeping us in line. Hat off to them and to this community for making this place a joy to be a part of.
And, with that, I'll just leave this here - Oregon will defy joint fish management on the lower Columbia River | OregonLive.com
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post #24 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-23-2017, 01:50 AM
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Did everyone miss that the Clean Water Act is now going to be repealed - that affects every river, stream, and coastline in the States

If that doesn't put things in perspective

You can read about on the White House website . . . or maybe you feel like dancing

I'm not sure but I think that is fishing related. You all decide
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post #25 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-23-2017, 02:29 AM
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My 2 Cents if I may!

Politics !!! this is where we as a country FAIL!! it is there side or are side!! face it that is what? 70% of this country's attitude towards politics! I think !
From all the post I have read here looking for '" All Things Spey " I thing everyone here would be cool about a political discussion! but it would only take
1 I say one post to start a chain reaction I have seen this on other forums in the car department forum
so I vote for ALL THINGS SPEY!!!
But yup here it comes, I do think since we do fish and we do impact are environment even in small ways just driving to where we wish to fish
has it's consequences car exhaust and so on. Then how many have you gone down to a fishing spot and see were someone dumped a bunch of fishing line or empty lure packages or empty bait containers??

I think this forum needs a forum for the environment WE USE! as in maybe cleaning a fishing hole up or helping in some other way???
being able to post rule changes and monitor laws that will affect are fishing and what we can do to stop it or help a good law
I said it before we are on the bottom of the food chain as in fishing!! you do not see that commercial fisherman standing up for your right to fish on the bank and then we can ONLY TAKE HATCHERY STEELHEAD AND SALMON!! the gill nets????
if we do not stand together in are little band of brothers and sisters, Where do we go to a forum like this if not here where??

BUT NO DARN POLITICS HERE PLEASE???
I wish to see no hate here!!!!! and that is what politics here will do!!!!

Bill



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post #26 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-23-2017, 03:44 AM
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Originally Posted by J.James View Post
Did everyone miss that the Clean Water Act is now going to be repealed - that affects every river, stream, and coastline in the States

If that doesn't put things in perspective

You can read about on the White House website . . . or maybe you feel like dancing
NOT TRUE, please do better research!!

This pertains to the Clean Water Ruling (WOTUS) not the Clean Water Act.
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post #27 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-23-2017, 04:59 AM
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I always find that political discussions are either nonexistent or very civil when live.
this never happens on an open forum so I reckon if you want to talk pollies join a pollie forum. simples.
and it'll be an awesome and sharing environment... everything there is split 50/50.

cheers,
shawn

Shawn,

First off I’m not your mate.
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post #28 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-23-2017, 08:20 AM
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NOT TRUE, please do better research!!

This pertains to the Clean Water Ruling (WOTUS) not the Clean Water Act.
I did!

ITS EXACTLY THE SAME

The Rule only defines the Act

"Despite the fact that the rule did no more than clarify existing protections put in place by the Clean Water Act (protections were not extended to any new waters) and that there has been no compelling evidence to suggest that the rule has in any way harmed jobs or industry (if anything, the rule is likely a boon to the over half a trillion dollar outdoor recreation industry), Trump made a declaration of his intention to eliminate the rule his first order of business."

Hatch Mag

and Directly from the White House:

"For too long, we’ve been held back by burdensome regulations on our energy industry. President Trump is committed to eliminating harmful and unnecessary policies such as the Climate Action Plan and the Waters of the U.S. rule. Lifting these restrictions will greatly help American workers, increasing wages by more than $30 billion over the next 7 years."

and Directly from the EPA:

"What the rule does

The rule ensures that waters protected under the Clean Water Act are more precisely defined, more predictably determined, and easier for businesses and industry to understand. Learn more about what the rule does.

What the rule does not do
The rule does not protect any new types of waters, regulate most ditches, apply to groundwater, create any new permitting requirements for agriculture, or address land use or private property rights. Learn more about what the rule does not do."

Now I'm sure that the appointment of a man who had repeatedly sued the EPA to get access for oil companies and is now heading the EPA in accordance with the appointment of oil tycoons to leadership roles throughout the new government ensures there's no real agenda here, just coincidence - you know with the repression of the endangered species act and the new legislation disallowing law suits to corporations specifically

Does there need to be a mineral mine on the Missouri River spewing waste into the river or an oil factory on the deschutes or perhaps a tire recycling plant on the green river for everyone to see what's up and stop fretting and start fighting?

Let's not be naive
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post #29 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-23-2017, 09:26 AM
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Quality fishing = Healthy watersheds

Healthy watersheds = Conservation

Conservation = Politics (unfortunately)
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post #30 of 32 (permalink) Old 01-23-2017, 09:38 AM
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I take back what I said. Politics of any kind should be off limits. This forum should not be used to push someone's personal agenda. I have had to on-follow and on-friend a hundred plus on face book, just to get my news feed back to fly fishing and fun positive posts. My vote is everything Two Handed (spey).

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