Ian Gordon - Spey Pages
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post #1 of 17 (permalink) Old 11-29-2017, 09:54 AM Thread Starter
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Ian Gordon

I love the way this guy casts.

... the pseudo-science of running-lines and matching heads has now devolved into such a miasma of obfuscation that it is a wonder that people are even not more confused....Erik Helm

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post #2 of 17 (permalink) Old 11-29-2017, 11:16 AM
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That's the way we all cast in Scotland...properly!


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post #3 of 17 (permalink) Old 11-29-2017, 11:36 AM
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My buddy Mark Huber just shared this exact video today on FB.
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post #4 of 17 (permalink) Old 11-29-2017, 12:18 PM
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I also watched it earlier today. There is a very good example of a Tailing Loop starting at 2:20 on right. Rod is too upright when the forward cast begins and the tip dips. There is slight Creep too. Perhaps stopping the forward cast later or accelerating longer could have avoided the TL? Of course Drifting would have been the best move!

Esa
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post #5 of 17 (permalink) Old 11-29-2017, 02:47 PM
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Ian is great. He has a fun affect about him, child like excitement after decades, wonderful stories and anecdotes, and has worked hard on attaining his position @Hardy

If you haven't watched it I highly recommend it especially during winter



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post #6 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-03-2017, 01:47 AM
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Very interesting side-by-sides. Thanks!
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post #7 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-03-2017, 08:15 AM
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Ian Gordon one of my favorite casters. I also like this one:

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post #8 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-03-2017, 08:23 AM
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Bender are we looking at the same video? I don't see a tailing loop!
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post #9 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-03-2017, 08:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Llandogo View Post
Bender are we looking at the same video? I don't see a tailing loop!
To me it seems you are good caster if you don't recognise a Tailing Loop

It is the video on Tims first post. Stop at 02:21 and half seconds and you see the concave fly line path and it is a Tailing Loop. The other has a convex line path which is not perfect either but much better of the two.

When Spey casting a TL does not often result a Collision Loop because the fly leg of the line loop travels more on side track when the anchor is placed to the side but it makes line loop rise when it arrives to the end and kills the cast. Casting TL is one way to make slack to the line but on that video it is a fault which should have been mentioned especially when there are long and short casting strokes compared.

I cast TLs more when I practice long casts which have less room for errors and it is usually because of bad back cast which makes too long and sticky anchor and rod bends more than it would have with a "lighter" anchor.

There are quite a lot of TLs in casting videos. It seems heavy Skagit lines which are cast with soft rods is quite common reason. Also a casting fault which is called Creep is one where rod is moved forward when the D-loop forms and it shortens the actual casting stroke. When rod is rised more up it comes even worse.

In this video link which I just watched there is one complete TL cast starting at 2:50 where you can see how it makes the line loop open up in the end and there is some Creep as well.


https://youtube.com/watch?v=V3kPieUqjCM

Esa
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Last edited by bender; 12-03-2017 at 09:32 AM.
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post #10 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-03-2017, 10:55 AM
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Bender, I think something must be getting lost in translation here. A tailing loop and and a collision loop are two different faults. Tailing loops are caused by the rod tip taking a concave rod path. A collision loop is usually caused by not taking the the line far enough up from your position and then making the forward cast, what you Scandinavians call crossing the line. Are you saying that the concave rod path in the video was the TL or that it would have resulted in a TL because I cannot see any evidence of it ending up a tailing loop? I accept there was a slight concave path but not sufficient to significantly spoil the cast. As an addendum to this post I would add, I have seen this fellow demonstrating a few times at Game fairs and he is is absolutely brilliant. I would put him in the old school of champions where timing was critical. As I have no doubt you will appreciate good timing can pull you out of quite a few scrapes. Incidentally the amount of creep involved was minimal, again not enough to influence the cast .You must be a brave man to critise a former world speycasting champion with his background and standing. I have seen it so often in this game where it is all to easy to get bogged down with technicality. I get confused easily nowadays but I have always believed in the KISS Method of learning i.e. KEEP IT SIMPLE STUPID.
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post #11 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-03-2017, 12:30 PM
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There comes a concave rod tip path because of too upright rod in the beginning of the casting stroke and it is a Tailing Loop no matter who casts! Perhaps the line was too heavy, rod too soft, anchor was bad, he did stop too high or he just tried to cast too far but that cast is not good because of TL. I would have Drifted!

I have met Ian Gordon and we discussed Spey casting and the Partridge rods which he designed which I have three and I know his gredits. Actually it is refreshing that even World Champions occacionally cast TLs. His other videos are good but that one does not have a good short stroke cast which suppose to be half of the video.

Esa
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post #12 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-03-2017, 12:50 PM
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I know we have had this discussion before, but in my opinion there are tailing loops and tailing loops. Maybe there should be a statute of limitations on “tailing loops” where deformations that do not in any way effect the result of the cast get a provisional pass. Otherwise casting becomes a kind of “dog show” where you get extra points for the “right” curlyness of hair, leg to torso lenght ratio, etc.

Now if you want to see a textbook tailing loop, there are probably many of those those that can be found that better illustrate them .... and usually close at hand.

I do not consider it in the least surprising that an expert caster throws a very minor, and functionally meaningless “tailing loop” every now and then, and certainly do not consider it a flaw. All this means to me in cases like this is that it is a caster that is trying to get the most out of the rod, and actually KNOWS where that edge is, and can flirt with that edge. Everything else is just style points.
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Last edited by Botsari; 12-03-2017 at 01:16 PM.
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post #13 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-03-2017, 01:19 PM
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I think it is better to learn using wide casting stroke although it widens line loops when casting short distance because narrow line loops are not needed when cast close and mid range. Then there is less need to change casting when a long cast is needed.

Esa
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post #14 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-03-2017, 01:31 PM
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Skagitmeister, I actually have a hard time watching this video. I’m afraid all the stops and rewinds on the power stroke have the same effect on my nervous system as the beginning of the “shave and a hair cut...” jingle have on Rodger Rabbit. Steam started to come out of my ears.

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post #15 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-03-2017, 01:36 PM
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I am going to make my final comment on this post. I am sure Mr Gordon's purpose of his video was to highlight the differences in casting styles which I think he did very well. They work. There is a danger here of confusing those new to speycasting. Do not get too technical. If you are able to get hold of his DVD do so, you will see he does not do tailing loops!
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