Skagit cast - Spey Pages
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post #1 of 19 (permalink) Old 10-19-2017, 09:00 PM Thread Starter
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Skagit cast

I just saw this and thought I'd share. Great visualization and explanation.
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post #2 of 19 (permalink) Old 10-20-2017, 04:55 PM
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CMCL and out & around, two things Ed is noted for.

I fish because the voices inside my head tell me to.
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post #3 of 19 (permalink) Old 10-25-2017, 02:32 PM
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Whatever helps. Right?

Just so long as CM/CL (recently debunked) and out & around are not taken too literally.
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post #4 of 19 (permalink) Old 10-25-2017, 02:54 PM
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Debunked?

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Originally Posted by fish0n4evr View Post
Whatever helps. Right?

Just so long as CM/CL (recently debunked) and out & around are not taken too literally.
I wouldn't call it debunked. Lots of misconceptions about Skagit casting out there. CM/CL is not one of them.
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post #5 of 19 (permalink) Old 10-25-2017, 03:51 PM
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I agree. There are some misunderstanding of what Ed Ward is trying to get across. Enough that Ed(riveraddict) himself has admitted here that both constant motion and load are not quite constant. Basically - cmcl is the idea of keeping the rod moving without the pause. Same way as in the vid above on "out and around" idea - it is the path that the rod takes , not exactly what the line does. On the DoubleSpey - rod must move out over the water to some degree. Either high or low and climbing in order to come to I'll call the "ready position" over the casting shoulder. No other way about it. So don't go literally trying to cast out and around .
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post #6 of 19 (permalink) Old 10-25-2017, 09:11 PM
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Cm/cl

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Originally Posted by fish0n4evr View Post
I agree. There are some misunderstanding of what Ed Ward is trying to get across. Enough that Ed(riveraddict) himself has admitted here that both constant motion and load are not quite constant. Basically - cmcl is the idea of keeping the rod moving without the pause. Same way as in the vid above on "out and around" idea - it is the path that the rod takes , not exactly what the line does. On the DoubleSpey - rod must move out over the water to some degree. Either high or low and climbing in order to come to I'll call the "ready position" over the casting shoulder. No other way about it. So don't go literally trying to cast out and around .
The misconceptions of which I speak have nothing to do with what Ed Ward is trying to get across. Constant Motion Constant Load is still as relevant as ever.
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post #7 of 19 (permalink) Old 10-25-2017, 11:01 PM
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fishon4ever...

...CM/CL debunked? If you're talking about some of my later writings about CM/CL, a "debunking" was not my intent... my point was that whether or not there is an "actual" CM or CL process, is a matter of personal perspective, perception and/or interpretation. Also, not understanding the doubt about an "out&around" action on a doublespey? Care to elaborate?
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post #8 of 19 (permalink) Old 10-26-2017, 12:09 AM
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I listened carefully to what Ed says in the video about placing the line in close. Close to the body. The line will be anchored, of course. It will not travel out beyond the rod, around like the golf ball does in the video.

The spey cast as a whole starts at the lift and runs clear through to the delivery, or to the splash-down depending on how you look at it. The constant motion in cmcl can only exist when the lifting and the set-up components of spey-casting are not taken into account. Otherwise, there can not be anything constant about cmcl. There is a pause, or break in the cast, only it is performed prior to the sweep.

That's what I'm speaking of that shouldn't be taken literally...

Last edited by fish0n4evr; 10-26-2017 at 12:27 AM. Reason: punctuation
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post #9 of 19 (permalink) Old 10-26-2017, 12:24 AM
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Ed,
I admit debunked is not exactly the right word. I certainly do not intent to reduce what you say or ridicule you. My apologies for that. To challenge or to question would have been more accurate. And I wrote the above, posted after you had chimed-in. I believe it dresses your question to the T. There's no doubt the rod moves out, horizontally over the water, up and around to the casting shoulder.

Vic.

P.S. Im stepping out for a dinner-date with my spouse. Looking forward on carrying on the conversation.
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post #10 of 19 (permalink) Old 10-26-2017, 12:37 AM
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Great video Ed.

Cheers,
Graeme
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post #11 of 19 (permalink) Old 10-26-2017, 12:42 AM
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Watching people attempting to argue with Ed Ward about Skagit casting is hilarious.
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post #12 of 19 (permalink) Old 10-26-2017, 01:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JonT View Post
Watching people attempting to argue with Ed Ward about Skagit casting is hilarious.
Laugh it up - Chuckles...

Seriously though - I argue there's more than a single way to cast skagit heads.
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post #13 of 19 (permalink) Old 10-26-2017, 03:24 AM
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Rod loading, with either water tension or moving line tension, need not be all or nothing. Some of the load is lost when the rod tip slows to change direction. But some tension remains, which is why even a sloppy Skagit cast goes downrange.
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post #14 of 19 (permalink) Old 10-26-2017, 05:00 AM
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Skagit cast

Good little video Ed,


This is where Constant motion casting started, kinda like a Spey/Belgian cast, if anybody doesn't know about the Belgian cast, its worth a google.

Grant in a letter to Jock Scott using his Highland Switch cast c1896.
Now some observations regarding what I call and mean by practical
fly casting. When casting on the Thames I called my cast a modification of the 'Spey' cast. Critical observers there called it the 'Planet' cast. Arthur D.Craeshay (Silver Grey) called it 'perpetual motion, for the simple reason that it was done with a tight line from end to end and not an atom of time lost in its delivery'. I was unconcerned what they called it and allowed them to call it what they chose. In any case it is the natural and practical cast, adaptable under whatever conditions a fisher may happen to find himself at the waterside, with trees or rocks in close proximity at his side or behind him and getting out a correct line, longer or shorter according to the position, and, if the obstructions are four or five yards away, he has full freedom, as though on the top of a mountain.
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post #15 of 19 (permalink) Old 10-26-2017, 10:59 AM
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Great video

Ed, another great video! Know that I appreciate your continued contributions. You will always be one of the great innovators in my eyes.
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